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Hi,

I'm hoping someone can shed some light on Robert Kleeman for me.
Born 1951 in London, we believe he originally had the surname "Bryant", until he moved in with a foster family later in childhood, and at some point changed his name to "Kleeman". I think he had siblings, but don't know names or even how many unfortunately.
He grew up in London and the South East, and moved to Yorkshire in the 1980's after getting married in 1978.
He sadly died in 1995, and so much information is still missing...it would be lovely to know more if anyone can help!

Thanks, Jen

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Have you got the cert for its info

ROBERT

Last name
KLEEMAN

Gender
Male

Birth day
23

Birth month
5

Birth year
1951

Age
-

Death quarter
3

Death year
1995

District
BRADFORD

District number
0811B

Register number
B53A

Entry number
083

Date of registration mm/yy
0795

County
Yorkshire

The informanf may be able help with into

What about the info on his marriage cert ?

ROBERT

Last name
KLEEMAN

Marriage quarter
3

Marriage year
1978

Registration month
-




MarriageFinder™ ROBERT KLEEMAN married
FRANCES M DOE

Spouse's last name
DOE

District
SURREY SOUTH WESTERN

District number
-

County
Surrey

Country
England

Volume
17

Page
1240

Record set

thankyou for your help...that's pretty much all the information I have at the moment...searching being made more difficult by him having changed his surname to Kleeman at some point...so tracing either his Foster or birth family is proving very challenging!

Kind regards, Jen

You probably need to purchase all 3 certificates.

Although technically the fathers name ( if Bryant mmn Bryant) on the MC should have been blank, he might have named his foster father. Witness names are always useful as is his address at the time. You could track down historical ER and see who is also listed at the address.

Have you checked to see if he had any children with Doe, or are you one of them?
How about relatives of his widow? They may remember being told a bit about his background.

Do you have the actual certs though

Wouldn't his wife have some knowledge of his background ?

Who does he name as his father on his marrige cert

It's not usual for a foster family to change a child's surname

Looks like his widow remarried in 1999

She is on the electoral rolls with her husband and her son Paul

Plus is on the electoral rolls with her son and daughter

The daughter married in 2002

Obviously won't post the info as its an invasion of their privacy but you can look for the info

Wouldn't the family have some knowledge of his background . Can't think that he didn't talk about his family to them and about his upbringing

Interestingly their daughter was born Ealing reg district !!

This looks like the most likely and would fit with his birth date

Births Jun 1951
Bryant Robert Kinnersley Willesden 5f 415

Willesden and Ealing are about 6 miles apart

Parents married in 1950 and he seems to be an only child

His mother

Births Dec 1932
Kinnersley Mary Mapp. Willesden 3a 448

There is one with the correct name registered in Willesden which is part of London in the right Quarter of 1851 - don't like to post too many details in case it isn't the right one???

I have found the parents etc but unless we have some more details we can't be sure.

Did he give his father's name on the marriage cert please? - Was it Edward A ??

Dea x

OOOpps !! - Shirley has already posted the full details........
- I haven't found deaths for these people yet Shirley and they might not be connected ??

Dea x

thanks for the suggestions everyone!

he was born in May 1951 - his son is my partner

the details of his birth family are rather sketchy - I understand (without too much detail on a public thread!) that there were some very difficult circumstances involved in him being taken in by the foster family, and I'm not sure whether they ultimately adopted him or not. Deed poll records are notoriously difficult for findings records of a change of name.
I believe he mentioned the name of his adopted/foster parents on his marriage certificate.
Unfortunately he never really spoke about what happened, even to his wife. I understand he did have siblings but not sure how many.
I'm sorry this is all so vague...

Are you sure he was born in London? There is a birth for the name Robert Bryant at the right time in Yorkshire. He has two possible siblings born in Woolwich.

Could he have been born in Yorkshire and then moved down to London and then decided to come back to his roots in Yorkshire after his marriage??

The two possible siblings who were born in Woolwich were born one before him and one afterwards so the parents must have moved from London to Yorkshire and then back again.

Kath. x

Are you able to give any further details by private message which might help us.

Feel free to send me a pm if so...

Dea x

Do you have the name of his foster/ adoptive father from his marriage?

Can you trace foster father on the London electoral register? Ancestry has them up to 1965.

If you are able to trace the foster family- there maybe living relatives that can help a little more?

Interesting the Robert born 1951 Willesden has mm Kinnersley- there is a Kinnersley/ Kleeman marriage in Willesden 1956:

Winnifred Kinnersley married Herbert Kleeman in 1956. She was born in 1907 and had been previously married to George V Kinnersley- but he died in 1951 Willesden.

I'm wondering if the foster parents were related to his birth parents?

I don't think he did it officially by Deed Poll. They are all in the Gazette and the only Kleeman (fortunately an easy name to search) is one in 1968 who changed his name to Kingsley.

It doesn't have to be done by Deed Poll. All you need to do is start using the new name - and this was much simpler before computers! :-)

The information re Winifred and Herbert- definitely related somewhere! So George Kinnersley dies in 1951- he and Winifred were living Twyford Abbey Road.- Look who is living with Winifred in 1953 (the parent's of Robert):

1953 Elecoral register
3 Abbey Farm Cottages, Twyford Abbey Road, Willesden, Roundwood
Edward Bryant
Mary Bryant
Winifred Kinnersley

a year later only Edward Bryant and Winifred Kinnersley are listed here then in 1956 just before Winifred married Mr Kleeman it looks like they are all listed together again.

By 1958 Winifred is living at the same address with Herbert Kleeman but the Bryants are no longer there.

I think it's possible that Robert's Mum, Mary, died , or that his parents separated, as there is another possible marriage for Edward in Willesden in 1958. May be this was why Winifred and Herbert fostered Robert?

It's also possible that Winifred was Robert's Grandmother:

Winifred and Husband George Kinnersley had a daughter, Mary in 1932- the likely mother of Robert.