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Christine in Yorkshire
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28 Mar 2014 18:19 |
Hi can anyone please help with another brick wall. I am looking for George Thomas W Duce born 1899 Ormskirk Lancs. Father GFW Duce Mother Mary Ann Roberts I have birth reg. and 1901 census details in England Also have emigration in 1904 and the Ellis Island forms show that by the time she arrived Mary Ann was calling herself a widow!
Have George on 1910 census in Luzerne USA by which time Mary Ann is married to a David Hughes (although I can't find a record of their marriage yet. Note George's surname on 1910 census is mis-spelled Duece.
Next and final time I can find George is on 1920 census still in Luzerne aged 21 where he is listed as a soldier US Army
Have the rest of the family through to the 1940s but can't find him - can anyone help please?
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ArgyllGran
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28 Mar 2014 18:38 |
A long shot. DOB wrong, but maybe?? Your George was living in Kingston, Luzerne in 1920:
U.S., Social Security Death Index, 1935-Current about George Dusa Name: George Dusa SSN: 189-03-8737 Last Residence: 18704 Kingston, Luzerne, Pennsylvania, USA BORN: 21 Mar 1896 Died: Jun 1966 State (Year) SSN issued: Pennsylvania (Before 1951)
EDIT: No, that 's not him. That one was born in Austria, according to his draft card.
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Christine in Yorkshire
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28 Mar 2014 18:52 |
Thanks very much ArgyllGran for that I am pretty certain that his birth was 1899 from BMD records although the US one may be wrong it's hard to know isn't it without more detail :-(
I have seen on Family Search a George F DUECE b. 1898 England (although it does say London) at Camp Furlong, Luna New Mexico in US Army and a death for the same name in 1920 at Del Rio Val Verde Texas but I am not a registered member so can't access the records
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ArgyllGran
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28 Mar 2014 19:12 |
The death is the right one, I think. His address is given as 30 Carle, Kingston, which is where he was living in 1920.
I've PM'd you the image.
Details: Male, white, single. DOB unknown; age 22 yrs, 7mths. Parents details unknown; mother's birthplace England, father's birthplace is a squiggle which might just possibly be France. Informant; someone at Camp Del Rio (can't make out the name) Date of death: 20/09/1920. Cause of death: gunshot wound.. Place of burial or removal: Kingston, PA
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JoonieCloonie
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28 Mar 2014 19:20 |
edit, Argyllgran got there ahead of me, so it does seem likely the Texas records are correct for him
..............
The 1920 census entry shown at familysearch
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/M4VT-7CW
does give an immigration date of 1904 so that is one more point of similarity
The 'F' might well be a mistranscribed 'T" someone with access to US records at Ancestry might check the original image?
Name: George F Duece Titles and Terms: Event Type: Census Event Year: 1920 Event Place: Camp Furlong, Luna, New Mexico, United States District: 72 Gender: Male Age: 22 Marital Status: Single Relationship to Head of Household: Soldier Birth Year (Estimated): 1898 Birthplace: England Immigration Year: 1904 Father's Birthplace: England Mother's Birthplace: England
while the death record apparently says London, England
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/KSBK-LVT
that could be just a general guess by someone in the military for instance
I would say father's birth place definitely says 'unknown, France'
by the way Christine it is free to sign in to familysearch, just use a pen name and throwaway email address (I do for everything on line just for privacy and to avoid spam etc)
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ArgyllGran
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28 Mar 2014 19:23 |
The Camp Furlong record is probably him, in view of the details in the death record. But it's the 1920 census, so he must have been listed twice, once at home, and once in camp.
Name: George F Duece Titles and Terms: Event Type: Census Event Year: 1920 Event Place: Camp Furlong, Luna, New Mexico, United States District: 72 Gender: Male Age: 22 Marital Status: Single Race: White Race (Original): White Can Read: Yes Can Write: Yes Relationship to Head of Household: Soldier Relationship to Head of Household (Original): Soldier Own or Rent: Birth Year (Estimated): 1898 Birthplace: England Immigration Year: 1904 Father's Birthplace: England Mother's Birthplace: England Sheet Number and Letter: 39A Household ID: 100 Line Number: 16 Affiliate Name: The U.S. National Archives and Records Administration (NARA) Affiliate Publication Number: T625 GS Film number: 1821076 Digital Folder Number: 004313377 Image Number: 00535 Household Gender Age Birthplace Soldier William B Bair M 22 Pennsylvania Soldier John F Bierce M 27 Ohio Soldier Harry Burrows M 19 Maryland Soldier Logan Candill M 21 Kentucky Soldier Lee J Collier M 18 Illinois Soldier James K Cousins M 21 North Carolina Soldier George F Duece M 22 England
(and many others)
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Christine in Yorkshire
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28 Mar 2014 19:24 |
Thank you again - I have pm'd you as the image didn't come thro but it certainly sounds as if this is my George
I wonder if this would have been reported in the Kingston newspapers?
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Christine in Yorkshire
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28 Mar 2014 19:26 |
sorry posts must have crossed - isn't it strange that he appeared on 2 censuses - but it may be that they were taken on different dates in different states?
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ArgyllGran
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28 Mar 2014 19:27 |
Jooniecloonie;- it does look like an "F" in the image.
It says he was naturalised in 1918.
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Christine in Yorkshire
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28 Mar 2014 19:33 |
thank you too JoonieCloonie
Perhaps someone will kindly pm me with the Camp Furlong image.
Thanks also for the Family Search info - I was a bit wary about registering but will do what you say now. His father was born in England but as we all know what's put on records isn't always accurate ! :-D I would appreciate any suggestions regarding how I could find out more details
many thanks
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Christine in Yorkshire
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28 Mar 2014 19:36 |
Sorry got to go and feed OH will be back asap
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ArgyllGran
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28 Mar 2014 19:48 |
I've sent it again, Christine.
Also the Camp Furlong record.
Re dates of records; the Luzerne census record was done on 8th January, and the Camp Furlong one was 26-27 January, so he could indeed have been in both places.
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Christine in Yorkshire
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28 Mar 2014 20:09 |
ArgyllGran
thank you so much for those - and the info re. the census. I really do much appreciate your help and time spent
I guess the next step for me is to see if the death was reported and try to find burial records.
re. my PM I've just realised what I'd read as workman is actually unknown Doh!!! :-D
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ArgyllGran
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29 Mar 2014 00:33 |
It says he was a polisher, Christine. Not sure what sort of Army job that was - can't find any information on Google.
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ArgyllGran
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29 Mar 2014 00:51 |
Found this:
George Duece of Kingston was accidentally shot and killed on a rifle range in Texas, where his regiment was stationed. http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~wbalmanacs/1921AlmanacMoreGoldStarDeaths1920.txt
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ArgyllGran
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29 Mar 2014 00:57 |
How sad!
"On the arrival of the body of George Deuce, a soldier who was accidentally shot at Del Rio, Texas, at his home, in - Kingston, accompanied by John Smith, of - Edwardsville; the details of his death were disclosed. The young man shot by another soldier while rehearsing a scene from "Uncle Tom's Cabin," the soldier who did the shooting being under the impression ttiaf his revolver was unloaded. " http://www.newspapers.com/newspage/52520779/
"WILKES - BARRE, Pa. Sept. 28. Private George Deuce, of the 12th cavalry, stationed at Del Rio, Tex. who was accidently shot and killed while rehearsing a scene in "Uncle Tom's Cabin," was buried from his home at Forty For.t yesterday. " http://www.newspapers.com/newspage/48898019/
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ArgyllGran
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29 Mar 2014 01:08 |
"SOLDIER'S BODY RETURNED. The body of George Deuce, a regular army soldier who was accidentally killed In Texas last week, is expected to arrive in this city today. It will be taken to the home of his parents at 39 Carroll street, Kingston. Funeral arrangements will not be made until the. body arrives."
http://contentdm1.accesspa.org/cdm/fullbrowser/collection/wbsunind/id/1268/rv/compoundobject/cpd/1290 (Small paragraph at the bottom of column 6 on page 1 of the paper.)
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mgnv
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29 Mar 2014 02:29 |
Christine's got the 1930 images now, it seems, so getting those free images is a bit redundant:
First locate the transcription on FS: https://familysearch.org/search/collection/list#page=1®ion=UNITED_STATES and note the important info (in 1930, this includes the NARA reel # explicitly). In the other years, the last 3 digits of the film # coincide with the NARA reel #'s, except 1910. 1910 needs a catalog look up. (EDIT for the film #) The FS hit has a free image link in 1850, 1870, 1900, 1940.
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/M4VT-7CW Household ID: 100 GS Film number: 1821076 Digital Folder Number: 004313377 Image Number: 00535
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/MNMX-Y57 Household ID: 72 GS Film number: 1821593 Digital Folder Number: 004384843 Image Number: 00893
Next go to https://archive.org/details/1920_census (or whever year you fancy) and pick the state, then the reel. Click the read online link and it takes you to an URL like: https://archive.org/stream/14thcensusofpopu1076unit#page/n0/mode/2up
Edit this, changing the page # and up-ness, to: https://archive.org/stream/14thcensusofpopu1076unit#page/n535/mode/1up or whatever your first guess is. The image # is close, but usually too high. One can usually check the h/h # and page back a couple of clicks. Sometimes one needs to look up a name on the page you've gotten, and see its image #.
Anyways, magnify 4 clicks, then save image: https://archive.org/stream/14thcensusofpopu1076unit#page/n533/mode/1up https://archive.org/stream/14thcensusofpopu1593unit#page/n888/mode/1up
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Unlike the UK, the US (and Canadian) censuses didn't distribute forms in the week before census night, but went round after the census and the enumerator filled in the info on the threshold (or maybe just inside, as the nominal census day was 1/1/1920). The info was supposed to reflect the status on the nominal census day, but it's a bit open to interpretation if George was a member of the h/h or not if he's newly enlisted.It was much more of a problem in the Canadian prairie census of 1/6/1916 as this was during WW1 (the census had a special column to indicate whether service personnel were serving elsewhere in Canada or else Overseas). Out west, the districts given to one enumerator could be huge by UK standards - I've seen instances of over 500 sq miles - so going round twice (to drop off and pick up forms) wasn't really practicable.
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mgnv
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29 Mar 2014 02:58 |
For reference: Using http://www.lancashirebmd.org.uk/ Lancashire Birth indexes for the years: 1899 Surname Forename(s) Sub-District Registers At Mother's Maiden Name Reference DUCE George Thomas W North Meols North Sefton ROBERTS NM/80/369
The North Meols Sub-district used to be in Ormskirk RD but now this falls in Sefton North RD
Lancashire Marriage indexes for the years: 1898 Surname Forename(s) Surname Forename(s) Church / Register Office Registers At Reference DUCE George F W ROBERTS Mary A St Andrew's, Southport North Sefton XC2/2/58
Births Mar 1899 (>99%) Duce George Thomas W Ormskirk 8b 852
Marriages Dec 1898 (>99%) DUCE George Frederick W Ormskirk 8b 1327 Roberts Mary Ann Ormskirk 8b 1327
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Christine in Yorkshire
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29 Mar 2014 10:20 |
Thank you Mgnv for all that helpful information I will print it out :-)
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