General Chat

Sorry, let me correct myself. In 1800 the United Kingdom of Great Britain & Ireland was formed (not just NI). The change to UK of GB & NI took place after the (the) Irish Free State was created in 1922. Don't know about the Welsh becoming self-sufficient, Sylvia. I somehow don't think that's exactly what Edward I had in mind, when he killed the last genuine Welsh ruler (or at least of Gwynedd) in a skirmish, and had his brother hanged, drawn and quartered for treason. Both their heads were subsequently stuck on spikes over the Tower of London! Philip

I'm glad to see I'm not the only one who remember "There'll always be an England". I had put it at No.2 for the choice of an English Anthem. I do think all this about being European has got nothing at all to do with the original question asked. The question was New Flag/National Anthem for UK. NOT should we consider ourselves part of Europe. Again I will give my answer to the question NO for either for the United Kingdom. Both the Union Flag and the National Anthem show the unification of the countries. However, if the question had been should England have a different flag and anthem for when they are being identified as a country in their own right and not combined with Scotland and Northern Ireland (and Wales of course) then the answer would be YES. St. Georges Flag and see above for choices of Anthem. Janet

Oh yes, memories, memories. The Gilbert & Sullivan operettas are really English. Nobody has ever heard of them abroad. They only know Gilbert O'Sullivan (he lives near here), but he has died a natural death, so to speak. I love that song too: "There'll always be an England". I love living in the Netherlands, but I still have a part of me that is English (also British). Sylvia

I'm sure that in one of Gilbert & Sullivan opperettas there is a song called 'There will always be an England' which we could use when we are doing something totally English as opposed to something British e.g. England v Wales at Rugby. Its quite a stirring song as I remember it from my dim and distant past!! Dee

A photo of Charles and Camilla on the flag. What a thought! He is after all Prince of Wales!

Being Welsh, the current Union Flag doesn't upset me, but how about having a sheep stuck on the front of it? Any objections? Just joking.

Philip, Maybe it was thought that Wales would themselves become self-sufficient and independent. They do have their own language which they still use. Only a thought!

Just to clarify, the first union flag was created after the union of England & Scotland in 1707 to form "the United Kingdom of Great Britain". (St George's and St Andrew's flags). This was further added to in 1800, when the UK of GB became the UK of GB & Northern Ireland (addition of St Patrick's flag). A Welsh flag or other device has never been included (grrr...) because, presumably, the English in 1707 took the view that Wales had been merely a principality since the time of Edward I in the late 1200s! Philip

Personally I really dislike the Union Jack and would much rather stick with the cross of St. George only. I also love the National Anthem and feel extremely patriotic when I hear it. I am English, I am not Irish, Welsh or Scottish and will never be a European. I hate it when a questionnaire or other does not give the option of stating your nationality except for saying you are from the UK. I do not wish to cause any offence to any neighbours! Naomi

Ann, Don't want to start an argument, but only quoted from what I learnt at school that England was part of Europe. I know Gt Britain is now surrounded by water, but doesn't stop them being Europeans. What about the football then, England playing in the European Championships. If they weren't European they wouldn't have been allowed to play! Only European teams playing. Sylvia

Isn't the Union flag a comination of the English, Scottish AND Welsh ? (Haven't got one to hand so can't visually check)

Sorry john, Just catching up. I would not like OtoJ because of the EU. As this has been hijacked by the EU then it reflects all the EU stands for. So no to both. Bob

If we were to use landmass as a definition of nationality, then presumably the Eurasian landmass from Calais to the Bering Straits and from Franz Josef Land to Singapore would form one country! Similarly, Jersey, Guernsey, each Scilly Island would be totally independent, GB would be one country, while the whole of Ireland would be another (apart from the old monastic rocks like Skellig Michael, that is, which would each have their own head of state, government etc! lol!). I think Sylvia meant that Britain is more part of Europe by virtue of location, shared history, cultural influences, religion, economic development down the centuries etc, than anywhere else. I certainly identify with Europe as my part of the world, rather than North America (USA plus hinterland!), Africa, Asia/ the Pacific Rim etc. Let's be ourselves (English etc, British), but recognise what we can share and celebrate with folks across the Channel (or The Sleeve, as our French cousins call it!). Philip

but we are seperated by water!! so we arent in the continent of europe. we are an individual island

I was also born in England, but Great Britain happens to be part of Europe. It is not Africa, Asia or Ameria.

I think that there are two different roles here. For everything for the UK or Great Britain e.g. when we compete as a whole like in the Olympics The Union Jack and God Save the Queen is fine. When we compete as England as in the present Euro 2004, then it should be the Cross of St. George and a different tune. 1. Land of Hope and Glory 2. There'll always be an England 3. Jerusalem 3. Rule Britannia After all IF the Scots or Welsh ever qualified would they have the Union Flag and God Save the Queen - I don't think so. Therefore England as opposed to GB or UK should have their own identity as well. Janet

The Union Jack is perfect as it is and should not be changed. However, "Land of Hope and Glory" (which I believe was originally composed as the new national anthem) would inspire far more patriotism than God save the Queen/King. No offence to our Queen who has hardly put a foot wrong, but look at who is to follow..... Kathy

sylvia im also english! not irish,welsh or scottish.or european susie

Jim on the Solent, If you are not European, then what are you? African, American. No, of course, you are a European.

lets keep the union jack flying, but change the national anthem to rule britania. penny