General Chat

Daniel, I quite agree. And when our children see what the older Criminals can get away with they have some very unsuitable Role Models. I was just looking to the future, there is no hope for today. It will take years to undo all the mistakes we are currenlty making. In fact it will probably take our Self Serving, Overpaid MPs years to work out how to.

Anne,Thanks for that.It was Terrible,and unfortunatly one of the children never got over it and killed herself.and I,m sure many others never get over the shockof crime committed against them,no matter how much counceling they recieve. Hal

Even if crime statistics per head of population remained the same the number of crimes would increase because we now have a larger population. What worries me is when the Police will openly admit that 2 or 3 youngsters are responsible for 80% of the local crimes and they are not able to be stopped. Dirty Harry would have stopped them. These kids need a real scare before they will realise it is better to be a good citizen than a bad one.

well david, I agree with your veiw.....i would think a lot of murders are committed on the spur of the moment and the last thing on the mind of the murderer, is if he is going to be hung or not...another veiw is some murderers would be convinced that they would'nt get caught anyway. I do however think that life imprisonment should mean life.

Grampa Jim, your right with what you say about discipline it went out the window about 19 years ago that was the first time i was told i was not allowed to smack my children, my son who was 2 at the time and had miss behaved so i gave him a smack across the top of his legs i was seen by a social worker who came over to tell me i couldn't do that and then told my son that if i smacked him again he was to tell another adult or the police. that was the start then the schools lost their control as did the police and the younger members of society wonder why children are the way they are today. i think too many old values have fallen by the wayside and should be brought back.

Brian. I totally agree only with no anesthetic let them suffer we do for the rest of our lives.

As for capital punishment I am 100% against. However, life should mean life with the criminal always having the choice as to how long that should be. They should be able to choose death at any time they wish by any means, within reason, they wish. This would alow any miscarriage of justice case to plead there inocence. Bob

Hi Brian, I won't go into the graphic details but studies show that rape is more often about power and control, rather than "just" sex. Castrated rapists (either chemical or physical) find other ways to exercise this control. So castrating them and letting them back into society does not remove the risk to the public nor their urge to control. I am totally against the death penalty, it has no place in a civilised society but I do believe that for certain crimes life should mean life. Recidivist paedophiles should be imprisoned for life with no prospect of release. Sex offenders are more likely to reoffend than any other category of criminal so "special" consideration needs to be given to this before sentence is passed IMO. Gwynne

i agree Roxanne it would have to be proved and yes Brian some do cry wolf but if they are found to do that then they should be named and shamed.

www.richard.clark32.btinternet*co.uk Just been looking and it gives alot of balanced view points of the subject.

Hi Brian, I don't agree that castration would work. I've emailed you privately to explain why. Gwynne

I realise that this thread started off tongue in cheek but the opinions put forward echo I would think the views of a great percentage of the population at the present time. I think that I am a bit older than Grampa Jim but surely the younger ones ( any of 50 and younger ) must appreciate that we have seen the largest increase in human misery brought about by our Govts in there blind policy of giving a second chance to all and sundry. The Good Lord Cried out "Forgive them for they knowest not what they do". Unfortunately that does not ring true in todays society. THEY DO KNOW WHAT THEY DO. Accordingly they should suffer the full sentance of laws made to fit and properly fit the crime even if that means hanging until death. I accept other peoples views and like other peoples thinking if some views dont change there will be no hope for the future generations in this country Rupert Bear.

yes Brian those accused shouldn't be named until found guilty. But all sex offenders should be named and their names should be made public.

Brian , yes that would be better as people do have the same name sometimes so this would keep the innocent people safe.

Thats justice for you.

At the Neighbourhood Watch conference we attended in November, our local Police claimed that, although crime figures were higher, this was largely due to a change in the way that crimes are reported. An instance given was where a victim of a beating would once have been able to say he/she was unwilling to press charges. Until recently the incident would have been recorded differently, if at all. Now, it is documented and kept on file, contributing to a higher overall crime figure. As already said above, there is likely to be a higher incidence of crime as population increases, but it is now being recognised that the decision to remove officers from the streets has been discredited, and Community Support Officers are being recruited and deployed as a deterrent presence on the streets. I hope this move proves successful. As far as sentencing goes, I wouldn't mind seeing the Fred Wests or Ian Huntleys being subjected to capital punishment, but there would have to be absolutely no doubt of guilt. I do firmly believe that a life sentence should be exactly 'what it says on the tin' for serious offenders, and, although it hadn't occurred to me before I read it on this thread, I do think there would be a great deal of merit in allowing people like Harold Shipman or Peter Sutcliffe to commit suicide. The society they have offended to such a degree should not be made to sustain them for the rest of their lives. (I believe that anyone who wishes to do so should be able to commit suicide - after all, it is their life.) CB >|<

I have found this to be a very interesting debate, thank you. It is always interesting to know and try to understand others point of view. We can all talk about certain cases that stand out in our minds, and many victims who should be with us today, and many murderers walking the streets because life was 12/15 years. Some-one mentioned that often murders were 'spur of the moment or rage killings". In France I believe there is a name for that, "Crime of Passion". Maybe that can be adopted by other countries. Brian (i) Yes, I believe in castration, I think in at least one country, maybe Canada, they have chemical castration. I also think that life is maybe too easy in prison. I would love to study and further my education, (maybe become a lawyer ) but my finances do not allow. If I were in prison I would be able to get a law degree "on the house". My husband tells me that every thing is on the double at some military prisons. I think that in countries like mine, Australia, prisons should be in solated areas and prisoners made to grow their own food and build their own shelters. Gampa Jim another to add to your list; Young people take drugs thus having no respect for them selves or their bodies. Some-one else mentioned that police have control on children. As a child in England, we were firightened of the local 'bobby'. If we were caught misbehaving, ( knocking on doors and running away ), we would get a clip around the ear. We wouldn't dare tell our parents because we would get another. I don't think it as done me any harm, I am a law abiding citizen. I do have some concerns for hanging etc, but there are some offenders who I don't think deserve to share the same earth as the rest of us.

Bring back chain gangs for lesser offences.

I think that all of us who put forward views on hanging (and other matters) owe Bob from Worcestershire a big thank you for creating such a terrific debate on what is and probably will always be a controversial subject. In my opinion each and every one contributor gleaned a valuable lesson on the opinions of the other participants, even though we may have to agree to disagree on the matters discussed. Thank you very much Bob. Rupert Bear

Well this thread certainly didn’t go the way I expected. I started it after reading the horrific account of an execution in the 18th century which reinforced my belief that capital punishment is barbaric and doesn’t work. I consider myself to be a pragmatist and have no objection to hanging and flogging in principle, just that a. It won’t work and b. It reinforces the view of those who believe that force and violence is the best way to win. Chris Lightfoot after an extensive statistical analysis (http://www.ex-parrot.*com/~chris/wwwitter/20040123-after-dinner_discussion.html) concludes – … “I have no idea why the homicide rate in England and Wales is rising and has been doing so since the 1960s, and I'm not certain that anyone else does either (though Peter Hitchens claims to with monotonous regularity on Start The Week, which really isn't a good thing on a Monday morning). I haven't found anything which answers the question (nor even approaches it in a very satisfactory way).....” My own belief is that crime is a symptom of a society which is bombarded with exhortations to acquire the latest must-have product and this together with the failure of our schools to educate the mainstream population, has created a disenchanted generation who believe that it is acceptable steal from others what they have no means of earning for themselves. This generation, bought up on a diet of violent entertainment on film and TV can see clearly that the easiest (or only) way to get what they must have is by force. For this generation I can see no cure other than improving detection rates and making our ever increasing police force more visible. Criminals invariable believe that they will get away with it and it seems that they are frequently right in that assumption. If they were more likely to get caught, whatever the punishment, many would be deterred from taking up crime as a career. Of course drugs play a large part and I am rapidly coming to the conclusion that, since we seem unable to stop them, we should legalise them, tax them and use the revenue generated to provide clinics etc. For the next the only answer is education and example. Perhaps if the popular TV shows showed honest, hard working people as successful and attractive (Can you think of one character in a soap who “made it” honestly?) then it is possible that more young people would want to copy them. Bob