Genealogy Chat

Hi, this may be long winded but i'm going to try and explain anyway. My Grandad was born in 1933 in a Salvation Army home to a lady named Mabel Johnson. He was then passed to a nursing mother Thora Johnson when he was born (both Johnsons, coincidence or not?) we have been trying to locate who his birth mother was for my grandads peace of mind as his adoptive mother took all the information to the grave. I first contacted the Salvation Army who were generous enough to give me an extract of the girls admission book which gave Mabel's age as 22 and address in Hull. Using her address in Hull i obtained the electrol records of that address which she is on but not with her family and only between the years 1932/33 ? She doesn't appear to be on the 1911 census so she must have been born after that was done. My Grandad remembers going to see her after he left the army in the Gipton area of Leeds and that she had a younger son and new family but can't remember anything about them now. On the extract from the Salvation Army it says that when she left she was sent to a home where she would work in domestic service. I have contacted them which is now a school for Christian studies but they have no records and i cant really get much out of them. What can i do next as i would really like to find out who she was for my Grandad. If anyone has any ideas i would really appriciate your input. I hope this makes sense but if it doesn't please feel free to ask.

Thank you,

A quick look reveals 7 Mabel Johnsons born in Yorkshire in 1911 (more if you include a couple of years either way to allow for vaguaries). So that route would prove tricky.
The local records office or local library may have details of the home she went to afterwards.
Also, in case the two Johnsons are not coincidence, I would research the nursing mother (Thora) and hope a Mabel of the right age crops up (maybe as a neice or similar) and fully research her.
I'm sure others will have other suggestions.

Hi Rob, Thora Johnson was the same age and born in 1911 which makes it really weird that she would have taken him on unless related as she was also unmarried when she adopted him. It says on the extract that Mabel Johnson was sent to Miss Blackburn, outwood house, outwood lane, horsforth, leeds. I can't find what that was used for anywhere.
I will research Thora i think and see what that brings up,

Thank you for your help.

Just to pinpoint the time your grandfather met his family which was 'after he left the army,' was this after National Service?-JLe

There is a Horsforth Museum and a Horsforth Village Historical Society. One or both of these will, I'm sure, be able to give you more info about Outwood House in those days and may be able to advise if any records survive and if so, where they are kept.

1911 address search redefine current search
Name Relation Condition/
Yrs married Sex Age Birth
Year Occupation Where Born Original
census
image

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BLACKBURN, Stanley Head Widower M 64 1847 Chartered Accountant Wakefield Yorks VIEW
BLACKBURN, W Mabel Daughter Single F 29 1882 Horsforth Yorks VIEW
BLACKBURN, Harold Son Single M 28 1883 Chartered Accountant Horsforth Yorks VIEW
BLACKBURN, C Enic Daughter Single F 27 1884 Horsforth Yorks VIEW
HINCHCLIFFE, Mary Jane Servant Single F 24 1887 Cook/ Domestic Danby Yorks VIEW
STABLES, Annie Servant Single F 21 1890 Housemaid Domestic Doncaster Yorks VIEW

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RG number:
RG14 Piece:
25972 Reference:
RG14PN25972 RG78PN1502 RD491 SD1 ED2 SN133

Registration District:
Wharfedale Sub District:
Horsforth Enumeration District:
2 Parish:
Horsforth

Address:
Outwood House Horsforth Leeds County:
Yorkshire (West riding)



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census search results 1911 address search

(not sure of address here?)

Chris :)

Hi Janet,

It was when he was around 21, he had done his national service and just left the coldstream guards so it would have been around 1954/55. He doesn't remember exactly though so it's quite a rough estimate.

Rob Thanks for that i am going to call them now and see if they can help i will keep you posted.

Thanks

This looks like Thora's birth (1910 rather than 1911):-

Name: Thora Johnson
Year of Registration: 1910
Quarter of Registration: Apr-May-Jun
District: Tadcaster
County: Yorkshire - West Riding
Volume: 9c
Page: 1024

Kath. x

1911 census - household transcription
Person: JOHNSON, Thora
Address: 34 Austhorp Road Crossgates
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JOHNSON, Fred Head Married M 45 1866 Boot Manufacturer's Agent Yorkshire Leeds
JOHNSON, Martha Wife Married
21 years F 43 1868 Yorkshire Leeds
JOHNSON, Harry S Single M 19 1892 Accountant's Clerk
Yorkshire Leeds
JOHNSON, Thora Daughter F 1 1910 Yorkshire Crossgates

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RG number:
RG14 Piece:
28343 Reference:
RG14PN28343 RG78PN1622 RD516 SD1 ED9 SN57

Registration District:
Tadcaster Sub District:
Aberford Enumeration District:
9 Parish:
Barwick in Elmet

Hi Yes sorry Thora was born 1910 thats correct, sorry my brains not working properly today!

The number for Horsforth Museum doesn't work i'll drop them an email.

Marriages Sep 1889 (>99%)
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>>>>>>>Aspinall Martha Leeds 9b 832
Eames Lilian Mary Leeds 9b 832
>>>>>>>Johnson Fred Leeds 9b 832
Ransford Alfred Leeds 9b 832

Between 1933 and 1947 there were 8 Mabel Johnsons married in the Leeds area. Whilst this is a lot to start with it might be worth looking at them all on freebmd and see if any names ring a bell with your grandfather. How did he manage to find her at the time , where did the information come from? What can he remember about the location? Was the younger brother,his mothers child or the child of her new family? ... just trying to look at all the options-JLe

England & Wales, National Probate Calendar (Index of Wills and Administrations),1861-1941
about John Hartley Blackburn
Name: John Hartley Blackburn
Probate Date: 9 Aug 1937
Death Date: 5 Jun 1937
Death Place: Yorkshire, England
Registry: London

(This man was living at Outwood house in 1937, he is the same I posted above on 1911, wrongly transcribed as Stanley!, not sure if this helps you)

Chris :)

The miss Blackburn, was probaby the daughter of the above,Winifred Mabel b. 1881 death 1943, also mentioned in the Will. (spinster).
On 1901 census, she is down as visitor to a Samuel Vincent, Wesleyan Minister.

I have asked my Grandad some many times and he just can't remember anything like how he found out her address etc. Sorry i know it would be so much help if he knew but he just doesn't.

Hi Chris,

Thanks for that. Everything helps me so thank you.

As he was born after 1927, do you think he was formerly adopted?
If so, he could apply to see his file, which may have more details.


Gwyn

Hi Gywn I'll ask him and try find out!

Don't like to go against the flow of the thread but is the Thora Johnson the definite person that has been mentioned.
The reason I query it, is that there is a Thora Johnson born in Doncaster Yorkshire in 1903. There is also a Mabel Johnson born Doncaster Yorkshire in Sep 1911 with the mothers maiden name of Walton. These parents were married in Doncaster 1892. I haven't access to the 1911 to see where this Thora was living at the time.
I have to go out now so I will leave you to ponder .-JLe

This is the only other Thora Johnson that comes up Janet?

1911 census - household transcription
Person: JOHNSON, Thora
Address: 42 Fitzwilliam St Swinton
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JOHNSON, Herbert Head Married M 27 1884 Railway Wagon Repairer Swinton Yorks
JOHNSON, Eleanor Wife Married 8 years F 28 1883 Swinton Yorks
JOHNSON, Thora Daughter F 7 1904 School Mexbrough Yorks
JOHNSON, Herbert Son M 5 1906 School Doncaster Yorks
JOHNSON, Alfred Son M 3 1908 Swinton Yorks

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RG number:
RG14 Piece:
28122 Reference:
RG14PN28122 RG78PN1606 RD511 SD5 ED13 SN191

Registration District:
Rotherham Sub District:
Wath Enumeration District:
13 Parish:
Swinton