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Dea
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11 Jun 2016 08:48 |
So, 'your' John died in 1974 then.......
Name: John Brown Birth Date: 4 May 1887 Date of Registration: Mar 1974 Age at Death: 86 Registration district: Greenwich Inferred County: Greater London Volume: 5b Page: 1017
Did you find out if your friend had that marriage cert. or any other details?
Dea x
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Gwyn in Kent
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10 Jun 2016 22:13 |
Sorry about the long delay between posts.
Computer is broken and I'm having to borrow laptop, when it's not needed by family members..........
Yes,Sylvia,I think your find for 1901 is probably correct.
He's not easy to track with such a common name and constant change of occupation.
Dea
That could have built into an interesting scenario, but I know John was alive much later........ Thanks for still searching.
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Dea
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10 Jun 2016 10:40 |
Oh dear !!! - I think this puts a stop to that theory :-( :-(
Brown Household (4 People) 26 Holland Street , Brighton C.B., Sussex, England Start free family tree View original image Print First name(s) Last name(s) DOB Occupation John ? Brown 12 May 1890 Photographer All Br?ches ~??? Brown 05 Mar 1892 Unpaid Domestic Duties (looks like Nellie on image) Mary Homer (Brown) 25 Feb 1922 Printing Machine Hand Marjorie Homer (Brown) 08 May 1932 At School
Deaths Sep 1952 BROWN John W O 62 Brighton 5h 84
Dea x :-(
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Dea
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10 Jun 2016 10:20 |
Looks like 'that' John married a Nelly Vickers - could that have been his first wife who you are looking for?
Name: John William Osborn Brown Record Type: Baptism Baptism Date: 26 Jun 1890 Father's name: John Brown - Boot maker Mother's name: Annie Brown Parish or Poor Law Union: Paddington St Mary Magdalene Borough: Westminster Register Type: Parish Registers Born 12th May - 69 Coronet ??? St.
Marriages Jun 1911 (>99%) **BROWN John W O Brighton 2b 504 Scan available - click to view EPPS Edith L Brighton 2b 504 Scan available - click to view Howard William H Brighton 2b 504 Scan available - click to view **Vickers Nellie Brighton 2b 504
They had possibly 5 children - the youngest born 1932 all in Brighton so it 'could' fit?
Dea x
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Dea
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10 Jun 2016 09:29 |
Marriages Jun 1880 (>99%) **Brown John Weymouth 5a 497 Scan available - click to view Sansom William Weymouth 5a 497 Scan available - click to view **SHEPHARD Annie Weymouth 5a 497 Scan available - click to view STONE Mary Elizabeth Weymouth 5a 497 Scan available - click to view
Dea x
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Dea
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10 Jun 2016 09:22 |
Must go and get dressed but I think that this could be relevant??
????????????????? - VERY strange ages !!! Name: John Brown Age in 1911: 20 Estimated birth year: abt 1891 Relation to Head: Son Gender: Male Birth Place: Paddington, London, England Civil Parish: Brighton Search Photos: Search for 'Brighton' in the UK City, Town and Village Photos collection County/Island: Sussex Country: England Street address: 13 Sloane Street Brighton Marital Status: Single Occupation: Bacon Draper *** He is a grocers porter - Mother Annie is a bacon DRYER. Registration district: Brighton Registration District Number: 79 Sub-registration district: East Brighton ED, institution, or vessel: 22 Household schedule number: 117 Piece: 5110 Household Members: Name Age *Annie Brown 29 - widow, married 31 years, 6 children (3 have died). John Brown 20 b. Paddington James Robert Brown 17 b. Brighton
*Annie b. Broadway, Dorset.
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Name: John William Osborn Brown - Bacon Curer !!! Gender: Male Birth Date: abt 1891 Birth Place: Paddington, Middlesex, England Enlistment Age: 18 Document Year: 1909 Regimental Number: 601 Other Regimental Numbers: 5456, 40448 Regiment Name: Royal Field Artillery Number of Images: 4 Form Title: Territorial Force Attestation Other Records: Search for 'John William Osborn Brown' in other WWI collections Family Members: Name Relation to Soldier John William Osborn Brown Self (Head) Annie Sheppard Mother - ***** 13 SLOANE ST, BRIGHTON !!! Cancel
1901 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription 2, Bloomsbury Place, Brighton, Sussex, England
Learn more Print transcription View image Household Members First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Gender Age Birth year Occupation Birth place Richard A E Berkeley Head Married Male 44 1857 Traveller ( Wine Merchant) Herne Bay, Kent, England Transcription Florence C Berkeley Wife Married Female 41 1860 - Brixton, Surrey, England Transcription Louis A Margrat Boarder Single Male 23 1878 Wine Merchant France Transcription Annie Brown Servant Widow Female 46 1855 General Servant Domestic Broadway, Dorset, England Transcription ***William J Brown Boarder Single Male 10 1891 - Paddington, Middlesex, England Transcription James R Brown Boarder Single Male 6 1895 - Brighton, Sussex, England
Births Jun 1890 (>99%) Brown John William O Paddington 1a 52
Dea x
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SylviaInCanada
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10 Jun 2016 00:48 |
so is the 1901 Census that I found correct??
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Gwyn in Kent
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9 Jun 2016 21:41 |
Sorry, Sylvia.I missed you there.........Thank you for sticking with this.
The names and occupations in the 1939 register are correct. My friend confirmed the address was known to her too.
John was a lodger in the household and later married a daughter of the family. We still don't know anything about a possible previous marriage for him and with such a common name we are unlikely to find proof,...but that's part of the challenge !
Many thanks for your help.
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Gwyn in Kent
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9 Jun 2016 21:22 |
Thank you .Dea.
I didn't know about the updating, that's why I was unsure from the posting just how the names were recorded in 1939.
This is the correct family and the BROWN link to Lilian is just coincidence. Frederick did have a distant link pre marriage to my friend's family, but on the maternal side rather than the paternal BROWNs.
My friend is very grateful for all the help given and also confirmed that John's father was David.
As to an earlier marriage for John, we'll keep on wondering...and looking.
Many thanks.
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SylviaInCanada
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9 Jun 2016 21:13 |
Just one point ...................
I found a John Brown living in London, b.ca 1889, and thought the same as Dea "only 2 years out", BUT .............. he was born in London, lived with his father and worked with fish
I THINK the one Dea found in 1939 with the Jeoffroys' and shown as Fish Curer is that one.
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Dea
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9 Jun 2016 18:37 |
As I posted earlier - both Doris and Lilian married 'Brown's '
Both later than 1939 - dates and details given above !!!
Doris was a Jeoffroy in 1939 but those details got updated until around 1991 (because they were used to start the records for the NHS)
Lilian alsdo started off as a Jeoffroy !!
Dea x
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Gwyn in Kent
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9 Jun 2016 17:40 |
Thank you for searching Sylvia and Dea.
The marriage to Doris looks correct, but I haven't been able to get in touch yet to find more details. Will try again............
Just to clarify.. Is Doris shown as BROWN in 1939?
and Lilian's surname too please.
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Dea
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9 Jun 2016 08:44 |
Lilian also married a 'Brown' - any connection?
Marriages Jun 1941 (>99%) Brown Frederick W Jeoffroy Ilford 4a 1443 Scan available - click to view JEOFFROY Lilian M Brown Ilford 4a 1443 Scan available - click to view
Dea x
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Dea
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9 Jun 2016 08:38 |
Did he marry a Doris please?
Marriages Jun 1942 (>99%) Brown John Jeoffrey Deptford 1d 1613 Scan available - click to view Edwards Josephine R Laney Deptford 1d 1613 Scan available - click to view Jeoffrey Doris A M Brown Deptford 1d 1613 Scan available - click to view Laney George E Edwards Deptford 1d 1613 Scan available - click to view
1939 Register Transcription
Jeoffrey Household (5 People) 48 Kerry Road , Deptford, London, England Start free family tree View original image Print First name(s) Last name(s) DOB Occupation John Brown 14 May 1889 Fish Curer William J (S) Jeoffrey 15 May 1872 Fishmongers Assistant Elizabeth Jeoffrey 01 Aug 1866 Unpaid Housewife Doris (Amy M) Brown 01 Apr 1908 Wholesale Newsagent Clerk Lilian (I M) Brown (Jeoffrey) 18 Feb 1903 Unpaid Domestic Dut
John's date of birth 'could' say 4th May ?? - The year is a couple out but this is not unusual.
Dea x
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SylviaInCanada
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8 Jun 2016 22:29 |
Is that your John Brown living in Hammersmith on the 1911, as Draper's Assistant?
If so, any marriage is likely to be in the London area.
I don't see him in the WW1 records, which could show a marriage and dependents.
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SylviaInCanada
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8 Jun 2016 22:19 |
Susan Stevens on the 1891 was Mother-in-Law
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SylviaInCanada
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8 Jun 2016 22:18 |
so this is that same family in 1901
1901 Census
Name: David Brown Age: 45 Estimated birth year: abt 1856 Relation to Head: Head Gender: Male Spouse: Ellen Brown Birth Place: West Hoathly, Sussex, England Civil Parish: Hove Search Photos: Search for 'Hove' in the UK City, Town and Village Photos collection Ecclesiastical parish: St Barnabas County/Island: Sussex Country: England
Registration district: Steyning Sub-registration district: Shoreham ED, institution, or vessel: 22
Piece: 938 Folio: 30 Page Number: 3 Household schedule number: 15
David Brown 45 Gardener Ellen Brown 49 b.ca 1852, Lechlade, Gloucestershire, Laundress Fanny M Brown 23 b.ca 1878, East Grinstead, Sussex, Laundress David Brown 19 b.ca 1882, East Grinstead, Railway Labourer John Brown 13 b.ca 1888, Brighton, Coal Boy Susan H Brown 11 b.ca 1890, Brighton
Address:- 19 Clarendon Road
hmmmm .......... could Ellen be a second wife??
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Gwyn in Kent
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8 Jun 2016 22:02 |
.......Trying to remember snippets of conversation, when we've talked about family, I think this MAY be John's family in 1891....
Name: David Brown Age: 37 Estimated birth year: abt 1854 Relation: Head Spouse's Name: Ellen Brown Gender: Male Where born: West Hoathly, Sussex, England Civil Parish: Brighton Ecclesiastical parish: St Martin County/Island: Sussex Country: England Street address:
Occupation:
Condition as to marriage:
Education:
Employment status:
View image Registration district: Brighton Sub registration district: St Peter ED, institution, or vessel: 34 Neighbors: View others on page Piece: 809 Folio: 91 Page Number: 12 Household Members: Name Age David Brown 37 Ellen Brown 39 Fanny M Brown 13 David Brown 9 John Brown 3 Susan H Brown 1 Susan Stevens 68
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Gwyn in Kent
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8 Jun 2016 21:46 |
Sylvia, Thank you for your interest.
My friend was an only child and very likely has paperwork relating to her parents.
I will ask tomorrow..............
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SylviaInCanada
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8 Jun 2016 21:33 |
does your friend have her father's marriage certificate?
That might help if he names a father
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