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mentioned in the record of Andrew Smith and Elizabeth Tattersell
Name: Andrew Smith
Spouse's Name: Elizabeth Tattersell
Event Date: 27 Jun 1818
Event Place: Gorbals,Lanark,Scotland
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: M11935-2 , System Origin: Scotland-ODM , GS Film number: 102941, 1042981, 0990755 ,

Thanks for that. Thats probably best way to know for sure...I'm just looking at his brother Edwards marriage to Ann Anderson when they were both only 16. Ann,s dad was also a shoemaker so seems it was a family trade. :-)

1851 census -
Occupation of Tailor more likely to be Tenter on original I believe.
Tenter - A framework on which milled cloth is stretched for drying without shrinkage.

The 1851 and 1861 census say that William was born in Halifax 1838.
ie census year 1861 - age 23 = 1838, but there is more of a chance that the birth would be census date 1837 to end of 1837.

However, in this case FMP has a baptism record which is probably for William which does say he was born in 1838

Halifax St John Baptisms Transcription

First name(s) WILLIAM
Last name SMITH
Birth year 1838
Birth date -
Baptism year 1838
Baptism day 27
Baptism month Feb
Father's first name(s) Andrew
Father's residence Halifax
Mother's first name(s) Elizabeth
Mother's last name -
Mother's residence -
Relationship Son
Occupation Shoemaker
Place HALIFAX
Church St John
County Yorkshire, Yorkshire (West Riding)
Country England
Notes -
Checked Y
Registry Number 2226

------------------------------------------
If correct then freebmd has 3 Halifax birth registrations for the March Qtr 1838

Births Mar 1838 (>99%)

SMITH William Halifax 22 239
SMITH William Halifax 22 215
Smith William Taylor Halifax 23 276

If you use the GRO certificate ordering service you can order a certificate without specifying the reference number, but instead use 01/01/838 as the year of birth, his name, that of his parents (you don't need her maiden name) and Halifax as POB. They will then search records for 1838 plus a year either side.
The cost of a certificate is £9.25 and should tell you the maiden name of Elizabeth

https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates

Armed with that, you can then come back to this thread (don't start another) for further help and/or migrate to Scotlands People website - free to join but pay for credits.
Credits cost £7 for 30. Lists of search returns (up to 25 a page) like I have posted above will cost 1 credit, to look at and download the full details will cost 5 credits.

Bear in mind registration in Scotland didn't start until 1855, so records prior to that will be from Parish registers and will not give as much information.

So it's a possible Elizabeth tattersall ...wondering about the king then...unless it's Andrew king Smith. If any of the possible parents of Andrew were involved in shoemaking ...that could be a clue. Or working as tailors which seems like another family trade. ....I will try and do a bit more research but thank you so much for all the information you have given to me. :-)

Oh it's a difficult one..many options. Thanks f or all your hard work. Maybe I'll never know. Is the surname king maiden name perhaps of mother Elizabeth do you think? Wondering if that is what that last entry is? :-)

???
Your OPR Births & Baptisms Search Returns

You searched for: Surname: "SMITH"; Surname Option: Exact; Forename: "MARGARET"; Forename Option: Prefix; Sex: "Any"; Parent 1 Name: "ANDREW"; Date From: 01 January 1822; Date To: 31 December 1828; County: LANARK;

Refine your search

Jump to page: of 1 (1 records)
No Date Surname Forename Parent NamesFrame No. S ex Parish City/County GROSData
1 19/10/1823 SMITH MARGARET KING ANDREW SMITH/ F GORBALS GLASGOW CITY CITY/LANARK 644/02 0040 0080

Your OPR Banns & Marriages Search Returns
You searched for: Surname: "SMITH"; Surname Option: Exact; Forename: "andrew"; Forename Option: Prefix; Sex: "Any"; Spouse's Surname: "elizabeth"; Date From: 01 January 1815; Date To: 31 December 1830;


Jump to page: of 1 (10 records)
No Date Surname Forename Spouse Name
Frame No S ex Parish City/County GROS Data Image Extract
1 25/03/1815 SMITH ANDREW ELIZABETH COLLIE/ M OLD MACHAR ABERDEEN CITY CITY/ABERDEEN 168/0B 0080 0480
2 27/04/1816 SMITH ANDREW ELIZABETH LEISHMAN/FR1435 (FR1435) M KILSYTH /STIRLING 483/00 0060 0292
3 01/01/1817 SMITH ANDREW ELIZABETH MCCRONE/FR302 (FR302) M RICCARTON /AYR 611/00 0010 0423
4 27/06/1818 SMITH ANDREW ELIZABETH TATTERSELL/FR662 (FR662) M GORBALS GLASGOW CITY CITY/LANARK 644/02 0030 0195 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
5 10/02/1820 SMITH ANDREW ELIZABETH HARDY/FR877 (FR877) M OLD DEER /ABERDEEN 228/00 0040 0390
6 28/02/1820 SMITH ANDREW ELIZABETH FINLAY/ M DUNDEE DUNDEE CITY CITY/ANGUS 282/00 0210 0006
7 29/03/1822 SMITH ANDREW ELIZABETH MCPHERSON/FR490 (FR490) M ST CUTHBERT'S EDINBURGH CITY CITY/MIDLOTHIAN 685/02 0400 0473
8 16/03/1824 SMITH ANDREW ELIZABETH COLVILL/ M CAMPBELTOWN /ARGYLL 507/00 0060 0260
9 29/04/1825 SMITH ANDREW ELIZABETH MCANDREW/FR7883 (FR7883) M PERTH /PERTH 387/00 0300 0238
10 13/02/1825 SMITH ANDREW BONNAR ELIZABETH DUDGEON/FR1008 (FR1008) M GLADSMUIR /EAST LOTHIAN 708/00 0040 0193

???
Your OPR Births & Baptisms Search Returns
You searched for: Surname: "SMITH"; Surname Option: Exact; Forename: "ROBERT"; Forename Option: Prefix; Sex: "Any"; Parent 1 Name: "ANDREW"; Parent 2 Name: "ELIZABETH"; Date From: 01 January 1834; Date To: 31 December 1838;

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Jump to page: of 1 (1 records)
No Date Surname Forename Parent Names Frame No. S ex Parish City/County GROSData
1 13/07/1835 SMITH ROBERT ANDREW SMITH/ELIZABETH TATTRSELL FR4837 (FR4837) M GLASGOW GLASGOW CITY CITY/LANARK 644/01 0340 0205

Scotland's People choice of AndrewSmith 1790 - 1805

Your OPR Births & Baptisms Search Returns
You searched for: Surname: "smith"; Surname Option: Exact; Forename: "andrew"; Forename Option: Prefix; Sex: "Any"; Date From: 01 January 1790; Date To: 31 December 1805; County: AYR;

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Jump to page: of 1 (12 records)
No Date Surname Forename Parent Name Frame No. S ex Parish City/County GROSData
1 10/10/1790 SMITH ANDREW JOHN SMITH/JANET REID FR126 (FR126) M RICCARTON /AYR 611/00 0010 0221
2 02/10/1791 SMITH ANDREW ANDREW SMITH/MARGARET LOVE FR485 (FR485) M BEITH (AYR) /AYR 581/00 0020 0478
3 27/09/1795 SMITH ANDREW ANDREW SMITH/AGNES BARBER FR367 (FR367) M GALSTON /AYR 593/00 0020 0090
4 20/12/1795 SMITH ANDREW JOHN SMITH/ANN MURRAY FR101V2-1 (FR101) M NEWTON ON AYR /AYR 612/02 0010 0086
5 10/05/1796 SMITH ANDREW ARCHIBALD SMITH/MARGARET THOMSON M DUNDONALD /AYR 590/00 0010 0210
6 05/06/1796 SMITH ANDREW ARCHIBALD SMITH/MARGARET THOMSON FR128 (FR128) M KILMAURS /AYR 598/00 0010 0237
7 07/05/1797 SMITH ANDREW WILLIAM SMITH/JEAN MERRIE FR345 (FR345) M MAUCHLINE /AYR 604/00 0020 0178
8 21/05/1797 SMITH ANDREW ANDREW SMITH/JEAN TAYLOR FR152 (FR152) M RICCARTON /AYR 611/00 0010 0262
9 09/09/1798 SMITH ANDREW JOHN SMITH/ELIZABETH BROWN FR880 CHILD 1 (FR880) M KILMARNOCK (AYR) /AYR 597/00 0030 0423
10 03/06/1804 SMITH ANDREW JAMES SMITH/ABIGAIL STEIL FR384 (FR384) M STEWARTON /AYR 616/00 0030 0223
11 30/09/1804 SMITH ANDREW JOHN SMITH/JANET RICHMOND FR449 (FR449) M LOUDOUN /AYR 603/00 0020 0069
12 30/10/1796 SMITH ANDREW WYLLIE JOHN SMITH/MARGARET FULTON FR735 (FR735) M AYR /AYR 578/00 0050 0064

Ancestry had Smets with a note in brackets (Andrew Smelt)

The only birth in Ayr itself that comes up on family search which would be from the marriage shown below. There are other Andrew Smiths in Ayrshire

Andrew Wyllie Smith
Scotland, Births and Baptisms
Name: Andrew Wyllie Smith
Gender: Male
Christening Date: 30 Oct 1796
Christening Place: AYR,AYR,SCOTLAND
Birth Date: 27 Oct 1796
Father's Name: John Smith
Mother's Name: Margaret Fulton
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C11578-8 , System Origin: Scotland-ODM , GS Film number: 1041330 ,
Attach to Family Tree

----------------------------------------------------

John Smith
mentioned in the record of John Smith and Margaret Fulton
Name: John Smith
Spouse's Name: Margaret Fulton
Event Date: 06 Nov 1795
Event Place: Ayr,Ayr,Scotland
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: M11963-2 , System Origin: Scotland-ODM , GS Film number: 1041331 ,

Thanks I had Smets from somewhere...maybe a?
Cheers ...appreciate your help :-D

FMP has them as Smelt on their transcription in 1841

Andrew ShM which I guess is Shoemaker and Margaret a C Spinner (Cotton spinner?)


1841 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Virnon Street, Whalley, Burnley Union, Lancashire, England

First name(s) Last name Gender Age Birth year Birth place
Andrew Smelt Male 40 1801 Scotland
Elezth Smelt Female 40 1801 Scotland
Margt Smelt Female 15 1826 Scotland
Edward Smelt Male 10 1831 Lancashire, England
Elezebeth Smelt Female 9 1832 Lancashire, England
Robert Smelt Male 5 1836 Lancashire, England
William Smelt Male 3 1838 Lancashire, England
John Smelt Male 0 1841 Lancashire, England

Yes..thank you...well done. Looks like correct family. Older siblings Edward and Margaret must already have married.
Think John Walsh and Margaret nee Smith down as Welsh on the 1851 census.

Ah...living with son Robert. Both Robert and his sister Margaret were born in Glasgow I think. No idea of the maiden name of Elisabeth..Andrews wife. :-)

??

Maybe lucky here - he is said to be from Ayr. But living in Blackburn

1851 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
6, James Square, Blackburn, Lancashire, England

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Gender Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Andrew Smith Head Married Male 54 1797 Shoe Maker Ayr, Ayrshire, Scotland
Elizabeth Smith Wife Married Female 52 1799 - Scotland Transcription
Elizabeth Smith Daughter Unmarried Female 19 1832 Cotton Spinner Scotland
Robert Smith Son Unmarried Male 15 1836 Shoe Maker Scotland
William Smith Son - Male 13 1838 Tailor Halifax, Yorkshire, England
John Smith Son - Male 10 1841 Tailor Burnley, Lancashire, England
Isaac Barrow Lodger Unmarried Male 19 1832 Shoemaker Kendal, Westmorland, England
George Pryce Lodger Unmarried Male 23 1828 Shoemaker Welshpool, Montgomeryshire, Wales
William Davis Lodger Unmarried Male 17 1834 Shoemaker Welshpool, Montgomeryshire, Wales
Joseph Widdel Lodger Unmarried Male 23 1828 Shoemaker Wakefield, Yorkshire, England

Occupation of Tailor more likely to be Tenter on original.
Tenter - A framework on which milled cloth is stretched for drying without shrinkage.

White lion street is given when John Walsh died in a mining accident in 1863. Maybe 1851 is when they live on Albion street? :-)

1861 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
29, White Lion Street, Burnley, Lancashire, England

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Gender Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Robert Smith Head Married Male 25 1836 Cordwainer Scotland
Mary Smith Wife Married Female 27 1834 Cordwainers Wife Burnley, Lancashire, England
Elizabeth Smith Daughter - Female 1 1860 - Burnley, Lancashire, England
William A Smith Son - Male 0 1861 - Burnley, Lancashire, England

Also as Lodgers
William Smith Married Male 23 1838 Power Loom Weaver Cotton Yorkshire Halifax
MAry Smith Wife Married Female 19 1842 Power Loom Weaver Cotton Lancs Colne

Maybe it is 1851 I have seen him on Albion street. A few doors away from his daughter Margaret Walsh nee Smith and John walsh etc. John Walsh miner born altham. Margaret born Glasgow in approx 1824. :-D