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Robert Bruce in census 1851:

Name: Robert Bruce
Age: 51
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1800
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Elizth Bruce
Gender: Male
Where born: Dunba, Scotland
Civil Parish: Limehouse
County/Island: Middlesex
Country: England

Household Members:
Name Age
Robert Bruce 51 c 1800 Dunba, Scotland Contractor.
Elizth Bruce 34 c1817 Darton, Lincolnshire, England
Sarah A Bruce 16 daur c1835 Buckingham
James Bruce 2 son c1845 Bentley, Hampshire, England
Robt Bruce 16 nephew c Oxfordshire, England smith
Robt Bougere 27 serv
Christ Durrand 20 serv
Mary Lingrove 17 serv

No signs of sons John or Walter from 1861. I guess nephew Robert might be worth pursuing to see if he left a male line.

I wondered if this were they, packed off to school.

Ages a little haphazard, and no places of birth, but there'a John and a Walter.

Name: Walter Bruce
Age: 6
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1845
Relation: Pupil (Institutional)
Gender: Male
Where born: N
Civil Parish: Hartley Westpall
County/Island: Hampshire
Country: England

Household Members:
Name Age
Thomas W Cuddeford 38 schooolmaster
Adile Cuddeford 37 school mistress
Thomas Cuddeford 8 son
Louis Cuddeford 5 son
John Bruce 14 c 1837 pupil
Robert Bruce 4 c1847 pupil
Walter Bruce 6 c1845 pupil
Mary Lee 13 serv

Currently can't find Walter John Bruce baptised 1869 after census 1891 ( he is not to be confused in the census with the Walter Joseph Bruce who married Eliza Jane Crozier in 1900).

Name: Walter John Bruce
Age: 21
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1870
Relation: Lodger
Gender: Male
Where born: St Pancras
Civil Parish: Paddington
Ecclesiastical parish: St Paul
County/Island: London
Country: England

Household Members:
Name Age
Ezekiel J Collison 43
Louisa Collison 41
Henry E Collison 21
William T Collison 20
Ezekiel J Collison 18
Charles A Collison 16
Ada L Collison 12
Ellen F Collison 8
Elizabeth M Collison 6
Edgar F Collison 2
Emma F Collison 4/12
John William James 18
Walter John Bruce 21

His occupation is recorded as undertaker.

I am a direct descendant of Henry William Bruce (1876) and last in line with the exception of my son aged 36 and still single with no prospects. Therefore to find a male Bruce from Robert (1800 about), and Walter (1847) the sons of Walter in Frank and Frederick (last trace 1901 census ) are the only hopes. Thanks to your information Frederick may have married to Rose and maybe died in 1914 with only a daughter but what of Frank ?
On other members of the family I have traced much information and even located an hithertoo unknown but now a friendly cousin, from a bigamus marriage but the Bruce males are really hard to track.
Any other help would merit lots of thanks.
Terry (Terence) Bruce

Seems John Bruce and Sarah Ann Bruce (Holden in 1861 census) both married Holdens, almost certainly siblings

Name: John Bruce- coal dealer
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1836
Age: 21
Spouse: Jane Holden
Spouse Age: 18
Record Type: Marriage
Event Date: 12 Feb 1857
Parish: Gray's Inn Road Holy Trinity
Borough: Hackney
Father Name: Robert Bruce - contractor
Spouse Father: John Holden - broker
Register Type: Parish Register

Bride married with permission of father as under age.

Name: Sarah Ann Bruce
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1836
Age: 18
Spouse: Charles Holden - undertaker
Spouse Age: 19
Record Type: Marriage
Event Date: 13 Feb 1854
Parish: Gray's Inn Road Holy Trinity
Borough: Camden
Father Name: Robert Bruce - railroad contractor
Spouse Father: John Holden - undertaker
Register Type: Parish Register

Apologies if you know this stuff already:

Name: Walker Bruce<<<<<< undertaker (Walter on image)
[Walter Bruce]
Spouse: Annie Billson
Record Type: Marriage
Event Date: 21 Apr 1867
Parish: All Saints, Camden Town
Borough: Camden
Father Name: Robert Bruce<<<<<<< contractor
Spouse Father: John Billson
Register Type: Parish Register

Later birth than expected:

Census 1861:

Name: Walter Bruce
Age: 14
Estimated Birth Year: 1847
Relation: Son (Child)
Father's name: Robert Bruce
Mother's name: Elizabeth Bruce
Gender: Male
Where born: Garvestone, Norfolk, England<<<<<<<<<<<<
Civil Parish: St Pancras
Ecclesiastical parish: Regent Square
County/Island: Middlesex
Country: England

Household Members:
Name Age
Robert Bruce 60 c1801 dinboro, Scotland Contractor on image
Elizabeth Bruce 50 c1811 Devon, Lincolnshire, England
Walter Bruce 14 c1847 Garvestone, Norfolk, England
Sarah Ann Holden 25 c1836 Buckinghamshire, England
Charles Holden 26 c1835 St Pancras, Middlesex, England

Charles is son in law,

There is also a separate household listed underneath on the census image for a John Bruce aged 22 born Buckinghamshire, wife Jane born Middx, and 2 small daurs. Both households living at 106 Crown or Crowmer St. Don't know how related, assuming he is.

As you've probably discovered, won't be a descendant of Charles Robert baptised 1873.

Sadly:

Deaths Jun 1876 BRUCE Charles Robert 3 Marylebone 1a 348

Presumably one son was your own grandfather , do you know his other direct male descendants if any, or can that line be eliminated from the search?

Are you looking for some sort of male DNA comparator? If so, and your current search is unsuccessful, could you take it back a generation, and look for direct male lines descended from Walter's brothers, if he had any, who would be a direct male line of descent from your 2 x great grandfather Bruce? Admittedly Walter was a little vague about his birth year, and Norfolk is also a tad general for a birth location.

Thanks to all of you for the replies. You have given me some information which will enable me to make further search. My final aim/hope is to locate a live male relative Bruce direct descendant from this family.

Thanks again to all

Terry Bruce

Welcome to the Community boards Terence.



(I'll let Terence know how to find his replies) :-)

1871 England, Wales & Scotland Census

Cleveland Street, St Pancras, Pancras, London, England

Walter Bruce Head - Male 26 1845 - Norfolk, England
Annie Bruce Wife - Female 24 1847 - Middlesex, England
Annie Susan Bruce Daughter - Female 3 1868 - Middlesex, England
Walter John Bruce Son - Male 1 1870 - Middlesex, England

Name: Annie Susan Bruce
Record Type: Baptism
Baptism Date: 15 Mar 1868
Father's name: Walter Bruce
Mother's name: Annie Bruce
Parish or Poor Law Union: St John the Evangelist, Charlotte Street
Borough: Camden
Register Type: Parish Registers

Name: Walter John Bruce
Record Type: Baptism
Baptism Date: 19 Dec 1869
Father's name: Walter Bruce
Mother's name: Annie Bruce
Parish or Poor Law Union: St John the Evangelist, Charlotte Street
Borough: Camden
Register Type: Parish Registers

Can't find census 1881 for the family.

Name: Alice Elizabeth Bruce
Record Type: Baptism
Baptism Date: 28 May 1871
Father's name: Walter Bruce
Mother's name: Annie Bruce
Parish or Poor Law Union: St John the Evangelist, Charlotte Street
Borough: Camden
Register Type: Parish Registers

Name: Charles Robert Bruce
Record Type: Baptism
Baptism Date: 9 Mar 1873
Father's name: Walter Bruce
Mother's name: Annie Bruce
Parish or Poor Law Union: St John the Evangelist, Charlotte Street
Borough: Camden
Register Type: Parish Registers

Baptisms for children from the 1891 census (there are others on London baptisms)

Name: Ada Jane Bruce
Record Type: Baptism
Baptism Date: 17 Jan 1875
Father's name: Walter Bruce
Mother's name: Annie Bruce
Parish or Poor Law Union: St John the Evangelist, Charlotte Street
Borough: Camden
Register Type: Parish Registers

Father an undertaker

Name: Henry William Bruce
Record Type: Baptism
Baptism Date: 1 Oct 1876
Father's name: Walter Bruce
Mother's name: Annie Bruce
Parish or Poor Law Union: St John the Evangelist, Charlotte Street
Borough: Camden
Register Type: Parish Registers

Father an Undertaker


Name: Maude Bruce
Record Type: Baptism
Baptism Date: 17 Feb 1878
Father's name: Walter Bruce
Mother's name: Annie Bruce
Parish or Poor Law Union: St John the Evangelist, Charlotte Street
Borough: Camden
Register Type: Parish Registers

Father an Undertaker

Family were livng Gt Portland St at the time of these baptisms

Apologies, census 1901 did say born Middlesex, but 1891 defo says Norfolk, and names of wife and sons tallies.:

1901 England, Wales & Scotland Census

13, Millman Street, St Andrew Holborn Above the Bars and St George the Martyr, Holborn, London, England


Walter Bruce Head Married Male 59 1842 Carpenter Marylebone, Middlesex, England
Annie Bruce Wife Married Female 56 1845 - Marylebone, Middlesex, England
Frank Bruce Son Single Male 21 1880 Carpenter's Labourer Marylebone, Middlesex, England
Frederick Bruce Son Single Male 19 1882 Carpenter's Labourer Marylebone, Middlesex, England

According to census, Walter was born Norfolk.

In census 1891, he is an undertaker, which tallies with the baptisms posted :

Name: Walter Bruce
Age: 46
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1845
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Annie Bruce
Gender: Male
Where born: Norfolk, England
Civil Parish: Bloomsbury St George
Ecclesiastical parish: Bloomsbury St George
County/Island: London
Country: England

Household Members:
Name Age
Walter Bruce 46<<<<<<<<<<
Annie Bruce 43<<<<<<<<<<<<
Ada Bruce 15
Henry Bruce 14
Maude Bruce 13
Frank Bruce 11<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Frederick Bruce 8<<<<<<<<<<<<

Walter Bruce
England and Wales Census, 1871
Name:
Walter Bruce
Event Type:
Census
Event Date:
1871
Gender:
Male
Age:
28
Relationship to Head of Household:
Self
Birthplace:
Islington, Middlesex
Schedule Type:
Household
Registration District:
Islington
Parish:
Islington
County:
London, Middlesex
Household Role Gender Age Birthplace
Walter Bruce Self M 28 Islington, Middlesex
Harriette Bruce Wife F 26 Not Known
Harriette Bruce Daughter F 4 Clapham, Surrey
Walter A Bruce Son M 3 Chatteris, Cambridgeshire
Charles S Bruce Son M 1 Islington, Middlesex

no birth for walter in 1842 but might be this one

Births Mar 1843 (>99%)
Bruce Walter Islington 3 215

Don't know if this is your man

Electoral register

Name: Frank Ernest Bruce
Year: 1935
County or Borough: Wandsworth
Ward or Division/Constituency: Balham and Tooting and Central
Street address: 41 Daly

Address should be 41 Wimbledon street, and there is an Emily Bruce at the same address, but don't know if it's 'your' Frank.

Well done finding Frederick's baptism, Andy ! :-)

???

No middle name though.

Name: Frank Bruce<<<<<
Birth Date: abt 1880<<<<
Date of Registration: Jun 1952
Age at Death: 72
Registration district: Pancras
Inferred County: London
Volume: 5d
Page: 371

???

Deaths Sep 1914 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Bruce Frederick A 32 Kensington 1a 124


Andy

This might be Frederick. Father also undertaker

Bruce on image.


Name:
Frederick Arthur Bouce
Record Type:Baptism
Baptism Date:3 Apr 1883
Father's name:Walter Bouce
Mother's name:Annie Bouce
Parish or Poor Law Union:St Marylebone All Saints
Borough:Westminster
Register Type:Parish Registers





Andy

That 1905 marriage has 'David' listed as the father on the parish record


Name: Frederick William Bruce
Spouse: Amy Agnes Hoods
Father: David Bruce
Other: Frederick Hoods