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Hi
I'm trying to find information about a Leslie F Golding who married my father's birth mother Ethel Hilda Griffiths at Oswestry Shropshire in 1931.

My father born at Oswestry 12/12/1922 Ronald Griffiths was given up by his mother at birth, sometime later possibly at the age of 7 or 8 not 100% sure he was brought up by William Ellis Jones and his wife Mary Catherine Jones, (formerly Griffiths) later they officially adopted him when he was 15, he was given the name Ronald Griffith Jones, (I imagine they retained his real mother's surname as his middle name)
My curiosity asks, is his adopted mother related to his real mother? same surname Griffths, can't find a connection though, and could my father's real mother have married my father's real father later on when she was more able to cope with bringing up a family? Can anyone please help.?

Brian

Get a copy of the marriage cert for Ethel, and of that for Mary, for info about their father(s)

Look for births for both Ethel and Mary................

There's a lot you can do using freebmd

Is this your grandmother?

GOLDING ETHEL HILDA 1896 1985 1985 Deaths & burials Coventry, Warwickshire, England

1911 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Elm Cottage Roft St Oswestry, Oswestry Urban, Shropshire, England


First name(s) Last name Relationship to household head Marital condition Gender Age Birth year Birth place Occupation
Timothy Matthew Griffiths Head Married Male 51 1860 Oswestry Shropshire Joiner Transcription
Elizabeth Griffiths Wife Married Female 41 1870 Machynlleth - Transcription
Teo Ewart Griffiths Son Single Male 11 1900 Oswestry Shropshire Clerk Transcription
Ethel Hilda Griffiths Daughter - Female 14 1897 Oswestry Shropshire - Transcription
Ada Lottie Griffiths Daughter - Female 12 1899 Oswestry School Transcription
Andrew Jaris Griffiths Son - Male 11 1900 Oswestry Shropshire School Transcription
Mary Stella Griffiths Daughter - Female 5 1906 Oswestry Shropshire - Transcription
Richard Trevor Griffiths Son - Male 0 1911 Oswestry Shropshire

First name(s) MARY C
Last name GRIFFITHS
Marriage quarter 3
Marriage year 1919
Registration month -
MarriageFinder™ MARY C GRIFFITHS married
WILLIAM E JONES
Spouse's last name JONES
District OSWESTRY
District number -
County Shropshire
Country England
Volume 6A
Page 1975

The idea that your father's natural parents eventually married is romantic, but unlikely.

I can't see any likely births during the marriage to Golding.....you may, of course, know otherwise

For info about Leslie, the marriage cert is essential.

It will tell you how old he was, his marital status, and (if known) his father's details

With that info, searches can be carried out

Thought it could be possible even though it's unlikely, my two main questions are, is his adopted mother Mary Catherine Jones, (formerly Griffiths) related to his natural mother Ethel Hilda Golding Formerly Griffiths? strange they both share the same maiden name.
My second question, can't find a record of Leslie F Golding on 1911 census on any other come to that but I do know he and my father's natural mother moved to Coventry after they married.
I would like to find out where my father was taken to when his mother gave him away after he was born, if it was a children's home etc before William and Mary took him on later.
It's so sad, he never talked about it.

Brian

The only way to get some of the answers is to buy copy certs, as per my earlier advice

Yes Jacqueline, that is be my natural grandmother Ethel Hilda Golding died 1985 Coventry, Warwickshire.

just for ref

1911 England Census about Ethel Hilda Griffiths
Name: Ethel Hilda Griffiths
Age in 1911: 14
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1897
Relation to Head: Daughter
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Oswestry, Shoprshire
Civil Parish: Oswestry Urban
County/Island: Shropshire
Country: England
Street address: Elm Cottage, Roft St, Oswestry
Occupation: Clerk
Registration district: Oswestry
Registration District Number: 350
Sub-registration district: Oswestry
ED, institution, or vessel: 18
Household schedule number: 19
Piece: 16147
Household Members:
Name Age
Timothy Matthew Griffiths 51
Elizabeth Griffiths 41
Stewart Griffiths 16
Ethel Hilda Griffiths 14
Ada Lottie Griffiths 12
Andrew Sdris Griffiths 11
Mary Stella Griffiths 5
Richard Trevor Griffiths

???
England & Wales, FreeBMD Birth Index, 1837-1915 about Leslie Frederick H W Golding
Name: Leslie Frederick H W Golding
Registration Year: 1895
Registration Quarter: Jul-Aug-Sep
Registration district: Ely
Inferred County: Cambridgeshire
Volume: 3b
Page: 525......

England & Wales, Death Index, 1916-2007 about Leslie Henry F W Golding
Name: Leslie Henry F W Golding
Birth Date: 1895
Date of Registration: Dec 1983
Age at Death: 88
Registration district: Coventry
Inferred County: West Midlands
Volume: 33
Page: 0307

332/B-HAD16/267 GOLDING Leslie F 1895

https://www.camdex.org.uk/search.cfm

(to match Maureen above)


1911 (Find My Past)
Frederick Golding Head Married Male 47 1864 Huntingdon St Ives Gas Fitter
Clara Golding Wife Married Female 45 1866 Cambridge Eversden -
Gladys Golding Daughter Single Female 20 1891 Huntingdon St Ives Drapers Assistant
Edna Golding Daughter Single Female 17 1894 Cambridge Hodder Lane Skirt Hand
Leslie Golding Son Single Male 15 1896 Cambridge Haddenham Office Gas
Address Church House
Parish Atherstone
County Warwickshire
Registration district Atherstone
Registration district number 387
Census reference
RG14PN 18430 RG78PN1107 RD387 SD1 ED12 SN133


1901 (Find My Past)
Frederick Golding Head Married Male 40 1861 Gas Fitter St Ives, Huntingdonshire, England
Clara Golding Wife Married Female 35 1866 - Cambridgeshire, England (Great Eversden)
Gladys Golding Daughter - Female 10 1891 - St Ives, Huntingdonshire, England
Edna Golding Daughter - Female 7 1894 - Godmanchester, Huntingdonshire, England
Leslie Golding Son - Male 5 1896 - Cambridgeshire, England (Ely, Haddenham)
Street Church Street
Parish Rushden
County Northamptonshire
Registration district Wellingborough
Archive reference RG13
Piece number 1441
Folio 38
Page 25


1891 (Find My Past)
Frederick W Golding Head Married Male 31 1860 Ironmonger St Ives, Huntingdonshire, England
Clara E Golding Wife Married Female 27 1864 - Great Eversden, Cambridgeshire, England
Margaret E Golding Daughter - Female 0 1891 - St Ives, Huntingdonshire, England
Mary A Miller Nurse Widow Female 68 1823 Monthly Nurse Domestic Whaddon, Hertfordshire, England
Street Bridge Street
Town St Ives
County Huntingdonshire
Registration district St Ives
Archive reference RG12
Piece number 1241
Folio 19
Page 2


(if relating!)

Chris :)


Births Jun 1891 (>99%)
-------------------------------------------------------------------
GOLDING Marguerite Gladys E St. Ives 3b 317


Marriages Mar 1890 (>99%) (Great Eversden)
--------------------------------------------------------------
GOLDING Frederick William Caxton 3b 523
Green Clara Ellen Caxton 3b 523


Deaths Mar 1948 (>99%)
---------------------------------------------------
Golding Clara E 84 Coventry 9c 699

Griffiths is not an uncommon name!!

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/trying_to_find/griffiths/thread/1252943

(relating?)

Chris :)

Hi Everyone contributing information regarding my thread, sorry have not responded, been away for a few days.
My main interest is to find out for definite if Mary Jones formally Mary Catherine Griffiths with her husband William Ellis Jones who adopted my father is related in any way to his real mother Ethel Hilda Griffiths.
When my father Ronald Griffiths was born 12/12/1922, he went into a childrens home, well that's what he told us years ago but we have a photo of him playing in Oswestry Town Brass Band taken around 1931-32 must have been taken when he was probably aged nine or ten, his adoption certificate is dated 1937, Oswestry Juvenile Court so you can see why I'm a bit baffled.
Sadly my father who passed away in the 1990s never talked much about it when any of us asked him. Question is what childrens home was he in, why was he living with his adopted parents before they adopted him?

Brian

there could be many reasons for adopting a teenager ......................... especially one who was old enough to have left school and be working


inheritance, more control over his future, etc etc etc



I just googled the following topic, and found many possible references for you to pore over, and see if any could fit .....................


reasons for adopting a teenager in 1930s Britain

My father Ronald Griffith Jones was born 12th December 1922 and he lived at 23 Lorne Street Oswestry at least from the age of 6 when he went to live with William Ellis Jones and his wife Mary Catherine Jones who's maiden name was Griffiths the same surname as his real mother, Ethel Hilda Griffiths, they gave my father their surname Jones, later they adopted him at the age of 15
My father had no idea what the name of his real mother was, I found all this out myself.
The clue was in my father's middle name Griffith, I looked at all births in Oswestry for Ronald Griffiths 12th December 1922 and Bingo it all added up.
So I sent off for a birth certificate with Ronald Griffiths born 1922 Oswestry and at the side of the certificate it said adopted, the certificate did not name his blood father, so by all accounts she was an unmarried mother. His adopted parents must have decided to keep a link to the surname of his real mother, although they left off the s after Griffith. Hope this added information helps.

Brian

Brian


I honestly do not know what else we can find for you to prove the theory that you want to prove.


I sincerely doubt that the man that your father's mother later married was your birth father .................

think about it ......................


why did they not marry until 9 years later?

why did they not take your father back?


It sounds much more like his birth mother gave up her child, and moved on with her life as much as she was able to, and then she met and married another man



No-one seems to have been able to find a family with sisters Ethel Hilda and Mary Catherine

Jacqueline and Rambling Rose both posted the same 1911 Census, which you seem to have completely ignored, and have never even commented on ....................

I re-post this same census, hoping that you do read it properly!!

1911 Census

Name: Ethel Hilda Griffiths
Age in 1911: 14
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1897
Relation to Head: Daughter
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Oswestry, Shoprshire
Civil Parish: Oswestry Urban
County/Island: Shropshire
Country: England
Street address: Elm Cottage, Roft St, Oswestry
Occupation: Clerk
Registration district: Oswestry

Timothy Matthew Griffiths 51
Elizabeth Griffiths 41
Stewart Griffiths 16
Ethel Hilda Griffiths 14
Ada Lottie Griffiths 12
Andrew Sdris Griffiths 11
Mary Stella Griffiths 5
Richard Trevor Griffiths


There is NO sister there called Mary Catherine



and here is the 1901 census for the same family, with no older child called Mary Catherine ..............

1901 Census

Name: Ethel H Griffiths
Age: 4
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1897
Relation to Head: Daughter
Gender: Female
Father: Timothy M Griffiths
Mother: Elizabeth Griffiths
Birth Place: Oswestry, Shropshire, England
Civil Parish: Oswestry
Ecclesiastical parish: Oswestry St Oswald
County/Island: Shropshire
Country: England

Registration district: Oswestry
Sub-registration district: Oswestry
ED, institution, or vessel: 18

Piece: 2545
Folio: 183
Page Number: 10
Household schedule number: 51

Timothy M Griffiths 41
Elizabeth Griffiths 31
George E Griffiths 6
Ethel H Griffiths 4
Ada L Griffiths 3
Andrew J Griffiths 1



As I also posted, Griffiths is a common name in Wales




I think you have to do what many of us have to do ................. realise that all the questions you have asked are not solvable


We helpers have no way of knowing why your father went in a children's home, why he was adopted at the age of 15 after having lived with foster parents for several years, nor whether his foster mother and his birth mother were related.



The only thing you can do ............... and we cannot do it for you ................. is to buy the marriage certificates for both Ethel Hilda and Mary Catherine and see who they name as their father, and what address they give for themselves.

Each certificate will cost £9.25, including p&p, from GRO

Thanks everyone for all your help, I'll take your advice about obtaining the birth certificates.

Brian