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Treemadnancy
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19 Feb 2014 19:39 |
ArgyllGran!! Peter above IS definitely the son of William born 1802 and Margaret. William 1802 is the son of William and Janet Scott...
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ArgyllGran
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19 Feb 2014 18:18 |
This looks like the Peter who married Janet Young:
1841 England Census about Peter Bryers Name: Peter Bryers Age: 15 Estimated birth year: abt 1826 Gender: Male Where born: Scotland Civil Parish: Tweedmouth Hundred: Islandshire County/Island: Durham Country: England Registration district: Berwick upon Tweed Sub-registration district: Berwick upon Tweed Neighbors: View others on page Piece: 318 Book: 12 Folio: 23 Page Number: 41 Household Members: Name Age Peter Bryers 15
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ArgyllGran
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19 Feb 2014 18:09 |
Peter's away from home in 1871:
1871 Scotland Census about William Byres Name: William Byres Age: 68 Estimated birth year: abt 1803 Relationship: Head Spouse's name : Margaret Byres Gender: Male Where born: Dalkeith, Edinburgh Registration Number: 701 Registration district: West Calder Civil Parish: West Calder County: Midlothian Address: Layford Occupation: Farmer 600 Acres 200 In Mable (probably "glebe" mistranscribed) Of Church ED: 9 Household schedule number: 71 LINE: 21 Roll: CSSCT1871_171 Household Members: Name Age William Byres 68 - Dalkeith Margaret Byres 61 Walter Byres 26 James Byres 14 Janet Byres 29 Margaret Byres Smith 7 - grand-daughter, born West Calder Jessie Steven 17 - servant Helen Brown 20 - servant
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ArgyllGran
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19 Feb 2014 18:03 |
The only record of the birth of a Peter Byers in Dalkeith at very approximately the right time is this one:
08/06/1834 BYERS PETER WILLIAM BYERS/MARGARET PEDEN FR2948 (FR2948) M DALKEITH /MIDLOTHIAN 683/00 0100 0225
And this could be him in 1841:
1841 Scotland Census about Peter Byres Name: Peter Byres Age: 7 Estimated birth year: abt 1834 Gender: Male Where born: Scotland Civil Parish: Linton County: Peeblesshire Address: Medwin Manse Parish Number: 773 Household Members: Name Age William Byres 36 Margaret Byres 36 William Byres 13 Helen Byres 11 Adam Byres 9 Peter Byres 7
But he's still with his parents in 1851 & 1861, so he's not the one who married Jane(t) Young:
1851 Scotland Census about William Byres Name: William Byres Relationship: Head Spouse's Name: Margaret Byres [William Byres] Gender: Male Where born: Dalhenthina, Midlothian Parish Number: 773 Civil Parish: West Linton County: Peeblesshire Address: Medwin Mains Occupation: Farmer Of 200 Ac ED: 4 Page: 2 (click to see others on page) Household schedule number: 7 LINE: 19 Roll: CSSCT1851_198 Household Members: Name Age William Byres Margaret Byres 47 William Byres 22 Helen Byres 20 Adam Byres 18 Peter Byres 16 Thomas Byres 14 Janet Byres 12 Walter Byres 10 Margaret Byres 8 James Byres 6
1861 Scotland Census about Peter Byers Name: Peter Byers Age: 23 Estimated birth year: abt 1838 Relationship: Son Father's Name: William Byers Mother's name: Margaret Byers Gender: Male Where born: West Linton, peebleshire Registration Number: 701 Registration district: West Calder Civil Parish: West Calder County: Midlothian Address: Longford Faron Occupation: Shepher ED: 5 Household schedule number: 57 LINE: 15 Roll: CSSCT1861_133 Household Members: Name Age William Byers 59 Margaret Byers 58 Peter Byers 23 Janet Byers 21 Walter Byers 18 James Byers 14 Catherine Gilchrist 36 Isabella Marshall 19 William Prentice 13
BUT . . . . . his father William was born 1802 in Dalkeith. Can this be William, son of your soldier William & Janet Scott?? In which case Peter would be William & Janet's grandson?
(Although not the one who married Janet Young)
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ArgyllGran
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19 Feb 2014 17:38 |
What makes your contact think he's a son of Richard and Janet? Has he/she found a record somewhere?
Going back to your original question - I don't think you'll ever be able to prove whether or not your William 1778/9 was the son of R&J.
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Treemadnancy
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19 Feb 2014 16:56 |
I know ArgyllGran...Its very bizarre! all the other children have been registered apart from Peter.. Yet his mother Janet Scott has apparently died inn 1824????
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ArgyllGran
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19 Feb 2014 15:05 |
I can't see a marriage for Peter and Jane(t) in either Scotland or England.
Can't see Peter on his own in 1841, and can't find his birth.
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ArgyllGran
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19 Feb 2014 14:43 |
for our ref:
1861 England Census about Peter Byers Name: Peter Byers Age: 36 Estimated birth year: 1825 Relation: Head Spouse's Name: Jane Byers Gender: Male Where born: Dalkeith, Scotland <<<<<<<<<<<<< Civil Parish: Gateshead Ecclesiastical parish: St Mary County/Island: Durham Country: England Registration district: Gateshead Sub-registration district: Gateshead ED, institution, or vessel: 5 Neighbors: View others on page Household schedule number: 94 Piece: 3800 Folio: 34 Page Number: 17 Household Members: Name Age Peter Byers 36 Jane Byers 37 - born Belford, Northumberland John Byers 14 Barbra Byers 12 William Byers 4 Jane A Byers 1
1851 England Census about Peter Byers Name: Peter Byers Age: 26 Estimated birth year: abt 1825 Relation: Head Spouse's Name: Jane Byers Gender: Male Where born: Scotland Civil Parish: Berwick upon Tweed Town: Berwick County/Island: Northumberland Country: England Registration district: Berwick Sub-registration district: Islandshire ED, institution, or vessel: 2i Neighbors: View others on page Household schedule number: 265 Piece: 2421 Folio: 559 Page Number: 58 Household Members: Name Age Peter Byers 26 Jane Byers 25 John Byers 4 Barbara Byers 2
1871 England Census about Peter Byers Name: Peter Byers Age: 46 Estimated birth year: abt 1825 Relation: Head Spouse's Name: Jane Byers Gender: Male Where born: Tweedmouth ??????? - ie - Berwick on Tweed Civil Parish: Sunderland Ecclesiastical parish: Trinity Town: Sunderland County/Island: Durham Country: England Registration district: Sunderland Sub-registration district: West Sunderland ED, institution, or vessel: 2 Household schedule number: 246 Piece: 5016 Folio: 64 Page Number: 44 Household Members: Name Age Peter Byers 46 Jane Byers 46 - born Berwick John Byers 25 Barbara Byers 23 William Byers 15 Jane Byers 12 Catherine Byers 9 Jane Watson 52 - lodger
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ArgyllGran
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19 Feb 2014 14:35 |
17/06/1821 BYRES ROBERT WILLIAM BYRES/JANET SCOTT FR2849 (FR2849) M DALKEITH /MIDLOTHIAN 683/00 0100 0029
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Treemadnancy
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19 Feb 2014 11:44 |
There is Robert Byres (note the spelling) born 1823, but I think he may have died. Also another Janet born 1814 which suggests that Janet born 1804 has died... Peter is on my other contacts tree born c1826 and married to Janet Young. Their first son William Byers was born in Berwick on treed. I cannot find a birth for Peter Byers/Byres although I do see him and his wife Janet on the census returns..??
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Treemadnancy
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18 Feb 2014 13:24 |
There is someone on Ancestry who has William born in England, fathers name is listed as Thomas.. This person has the same marriage details for William to Janet Scott etc, but only has one daughter listed born 1827? married to a McBeath? I have Elizabeth born c1812 married to the same chap...So quiet confused and not sure if I have it wrong or he does...I don't put too much faith on Ancestries
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ArgyllGran
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18 Feb 2014 13:22 |
Ah - found the death you mention, Nancy. Listed as Byer on SP, though the image says Byers.
No proof that this is the same man as either the man who married Janet Scott, or the son of Richard & Janet in Dumfries.
All it says is 20 Dec 1829 - William Byers, carter, Dalkeith, 51. Cause of death looks like "By a broom" but presumably isn't!
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alviegal
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18 Feb 2014 13:19 |
I see, the childrens' births appear to suggest his father's name was William and mother's name was Margaret.
1) William 1802 2) Janet 1804 3) Margaret 1806 4) Elizabeth 1812 5) Adam 1814 6) Walter 1817 7) Thomas 1823
Where do Robert and Peter fit in? Perhaps there have also been deaths though that should also mean that other children should have been named for the dead ones.
Scottish naming pattern. http://www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk
1st son named after father's father 2nd son named after mother's father 3rd son named after father 1st daughter named after mother's mother 2nd daughter named after father's mother 3rd daughter named after mother
Although this was not universally applied (some families adhered strictly, others “dabbled” and still others ignored it), it can still be helpful in determining the correct entry when confronting the relative lack of information in the OPR’s. It can also give rise to great confusion when eight children of the same family in a small parish name their offspring according to convention! The use of traditional naming patterns gradually declined during the 19th century.
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ArgyllGran
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18 Feb 2014 13:08 |
The 1779 birth posted by alviegal is the only one of that name in Scotland 1775-85 with parents Richard & Janet.
The fact that he was in the "Scotch Militia" probably doesn't necessarily mean he was born in Scotland. They sound like pretty much of a rabble from all over. If he was Scottish, then the 1779 one could well be him. Per Wikipedia:
Scottish militia
In the late 17th century, while the Kingdom of Scotland was still an independent country sharing a monarch with England, there were calls for the resurrection of the country's militia, with the understated aim of protecting the rights of Scots from English oppression.[1]
Following the merger of Scotland into the new Kingdom of Great Britain, the British Militia Act of 1757 did not apply in Scotland. There, the old traditional system continued, so that militia regiments existed in some places and not in others. This was resented by some, and the Militia Club, soon to become the Poker Club, was formed in Edinburgh to promote the raising of a Scottish militia. This and several other Edinburgh clubs became the crucible of the Scottish Enlightenment.
The Militia Act of 1797 empowered the Lord Lieutenants of Scotland to raise and command militia regiments in each of the "Counties, Stewartries, Cities, and Places" under their jurisdiction. At first the Act was opposed due to some believing the militia ballot would be used to enable the Crown to remove men from Scotland.[2].
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Treemadnancy
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18 Feb 2014 13:02 |
my source seems to think Williams parents are Richard and Janet Curruthers?? I'm a bit worried since none of the children are named after the paternal grandfather.. He has his death in 1829 aged 51 argylegran. He also has his wife Janet death in 1824 and William has remarried in 1829 to a Marion Scott.. Same year he died
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alviegal
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18 Feb 2014 13:00 |
Is this him? He is described as being married with 2 male sons. His address is 64 St Michael St. Dumfriess.
1879 British Army Service Records 1760-1915 Transcription First name(s): William Last name: BYERS Calculated year of birth: ? Parish of birth: Kirkmichael Town of birth: Dumfries County of birth: Dumfriesshire Age at attestation: 22 years 1 months Attestation date: Attestation corps: VOLUNTEER FOR THE MILITIA Attestation soldier number: 9512 Discharge rank: Discharge corps: King's Own Scottish Borderers - 25th Foot Discharge soldier number: The National Archives reference: WO96
EDIT No this one is far too young to be your man.
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alviegal
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18 Feb 2014 12:50 |
spouse: Janet Scott other: Adam Scott Name William Byers Birth Date Birthplace Age Spouse's Name Janet Scott Spouse's Birth Date Spouse's Birthplace Spouse's Age Event Date 20 Dec 1800 Event Place Edinburgh Parish,Edinburgh,Midlothian,Scotland Father's Name Mother's Name Spouse's Father's Name Adam Scott
Could you please clarify who you think are William's parents?
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ArgyllGran
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18 Feb 2014 12:38 |
Where did William die, Nancy? He didn't die in Scotland, or at least not in 1829.
Only one William Byers/Byres ( Byeres) died 1825-35, in 1835.
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alviegal
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18 Feb 2014 12:30 |
Betty Byers
Scotland, Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950 christening: 29 January 1786 , LOCHMABEN, DUMFRIES, SCOTLAND father: Richard Byers mother: Janet Carruthers
Ann Byers
Scotland, Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950 christening: 20 November 1791 , LOCHMABEN, DUMFRIES, SCOTLAND father: Richard Byers mother: Janet Carruthers
James Byres
Scotland, Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950 birth: 12 December 1775 christening: 17 December 1775 , LOCHMABEN, DUMFRIES, SCOTLAND residence: 1775 Lochmaben, Dumfries, Scotland father: Richard Byres mother: Janet Carruthers
Jean Byres
Scotland, Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950 birth: 9 February 1774 christening: 20 February 1774 , LOCHMABEN, DUMFRIES, SCOTLAND residence: 1774 Lochmaben, Dumfries, Scotland father: Richard Byres mother: Janet Carruthers
William Byers
Scotland, Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950 birth: 18 September 1779 christening: 20 September 1779 , LOCHMABEN, DUMFRIES, SCOTLAND residence: 1779 Lochmaben, Dumfries, Scotland father: Richard Byers mother: Jannet Carruthers
Margaret Byres
Scotland, Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950 christening: 11 January 1784 , LOCHMABEN, DUMFRIES, SCOTLAND residence: Lochmaben, Dumfries, Scotland father: Richard Byres mother: Jannet Carruthers
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alviegal
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18 Feb 2014 12:26 |
William Byers
Scotland, Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950 birth: 30 October 1802 christening: 28 November 1802 , DALKEITH, MIDLOTHIAN, SCOTLAND residence: 1802 Dalkeith, Midlothian, Scotland father: William Byers mother: Janet Scott
Adam Byers
Scotland, Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950 birth: 21 August 1814 christening: 11 September 1814 , DALKEITH, MIDLOTHIAN, SCOTLAND residence: 1814 Dalkeith, Midlothian, Scotland father: William Byers mother: Janet Scott
Margaret Byers
Scotland, Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950 birth: 18 October 1806 christening: 2 November 1806 , DALKEITH, MIDLOTHIAN, SCOTLAND residence: 1806 Dalkeith, Midlothian, Scotland father: William Byers mother: Janet Scott
Janet Byers
Scotland, Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950 birth: 14 May 1804 christening: 27 May 1804 , DALKEITH, MIDLOTHIAN, SCOTLAND residence: 1804 Dalkeith, Midlothian, Scotland father: William Byers mother: Janet Scott
Walter Byers
Scotland, Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950 birth: 16 April 1817 christening: 4 May 1817 , DALKEITH, MIDLOTHIAN, SCOTLAND residence: 1817 Dalkeith, Midlothian, Scotland father: William Byers mother: Janet Scott
Thomas Byers
Scotland, Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950 birth: 8 January 1823 christening: 2 February 1823 , DALKEITH, MIDLOTHIAN, SCOTLAND residence: 1823 Dalkeith, Midlothian, Scotland father: William Byers mother: Janet Scott
Elizabeth Byers
Scotland, Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950 birth: 21 May 1812 christening: 7 June 1812 , DALKEITH, MIDLOTHIAN, SCOTLAND residence: 1812 Dalkeith, Midlothian, Scotland father: William Byers mother: Janet Scott
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