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Change of occupation for Thomas in 1851 - now a Brickmaker but we have his POB:


1851 England Census
Thomas Bonson
Age:65
Estimated birth year:abt 1786
Relation:Head
Spouse's Name:Sarah Bonson
Where born:Clowden, Leicestershire, England
Civil Parish:Coventry Holy Trinity
Ecclesiastical parish:St Peter
County/Island:Warwickshire

Thomas Bonson 65
Sarah Bonson 67
Abraham Bonson 13
Louisa Bonson 11

Sarah and children b Bedworth.

Abraham and Louisa's births don't appear to have been registered

Just had another look at the 1841 I posted and James is 15 not 45. Living next door are Thomas and Mary Bonsor, both born Warwickshire:

Thomas Bonsor 65 b 1776
Mary Bonsor 60 b1781

Also, just noticed the 10 year age gap between Sophia & James and Abraham and Sarah - possibly Sarah was Thomas's second wife?

Looks like Sophia married Isaac Owen in 1851


England & Wales, FreeBMD Death Index, 1837-1915

Name:Sophia Owen

Estimated birth year:abt 1828

Date of Registration:Oct-Nov-Dec 1893

Age at Death:65

Registration district:Coventry

Inferred County:Warwickshire

Volume:6d

Page:361

Keith, we really need to work back from the 4 children you have listed. As I cannot find a death for Sophia under the Bonser name, presumably she married. When and where and who was her husband. I am guessing that you got her father's name from the marriage?

If you have the correct DOBs for Thomas 1801 and Thomas 1785, the elder one would only have been about 16 when the younger was born, not impossible but not likely.

Is this the family in 1841, if so I wouldn't think that they are related to the Thomas who married Mary Smith. This Thomas is Collier and the other Thomas was quite a wealthy farmer:


1841 England Census
Sophia Bonsor
Age:15
Estimated birth year:abt 1826
Gender:Female
Where born:Warwickshire, England
Civil Parish:Bedworth
Hundred:Knightlow (Kirby Division)
County/Island:
Warwickshire

Thomas Bonsor 40
Sarah Bonsor 40
James Bonsor 45
Sophia Bonsor 15
Mary Bonsor 10
Abraham Bonsor 4
Sarah Bonsor 4
Louisa Bonsor


As to whether your membership is limiting your searches, I am afraid I don't know as I don't use this site for searching - it didn't have any records when I joined 10 years ago, so I got used to using other sites.

Hi Gins,
Thank you once again.
I am still unsure if I have strayed off the scent incorrectly.
The Bonser children I have are:
Elizabeth c1819
William c1821
Sophia c1829 - 1893
Abraham ? not sure of birth / death
I linked them to a Thomas Bonser c1801 father & Sarah Bonser c1800 mother.
With Thomas his father also Thomas c1785 married to Mary c1788.
I am struggling to confirm this.
Am I limited being a standard member to the searches?
All the best
Keith

Keith, a lot of the info posted hasn't come from this site. Some of it is from the Ancestry site(probates & Baptisms). The Baptisms you should also be able to find on the familysearch site:

https://familysearch.org/search/record/results

To answer your original question, to search for bmd records pre 1837, you need to look in parish records. Not sure what PR records there are on this site, but the familysearch site has plenty and freereg also has some - they are transcriptions only.

When you get back this far, it is difficult to be certain about finding the correct person: fathers are not named on marriage records and mother's maiden names are rarely given on baptisms, so it is very easy to follow the wrong family back.

Can you tell us how you know that your Thomas was the son of Thomas and Mary Smith? There are a lot of Thomases with parents Thomas and Mary.

This is probably the Thomas/Mary Smith family in 1841 (found by searching for George as for some reason the family is shown as two separate households in the same house ( I have edited to show both entries and omitted a lot of names which do not seem to be connected):

Ages in this census were rounded down to the nearest 5 for over 21s:

Thomas Bonsor Not born in County
Age:50
Estimated Birth Year:abt 1791
Civil Parish:Tansor
Hundred:Willybrook
County/Island:Northamptonshire

Thomas Bonsor 50
Mary Bonser 50 Not born in County
Thomas Bonser 20 b Northamptonshire
Mary Bonser 20 Not born in County
George Bonser 14 B Northampstonshire

Keith, always look at images of all records (where available) you can sometimes get a lot more info.

Seems the Thomas mentioned in Janes probate is her brother


1871 England Census

Name:Jane Gee Nottingham

Age:35

Estimated Birth Year:abt 1836

Relation:Sister

Gender:Female

Where born:Bainton, Northamptonshire, England

Civil Parish:Ufford

County/Island:Northamptonshire

Country:England

Registration District:Stamford

Sub-registration District:Barnack

ED, institution, or vessel:5

Household Schedule Number:28

Piece:3310

Folio:75

Page Number:6

Household Members:


Thomas Nottingham 29
Eliza Nottingham 33
Eliza Mason 66
Harriet Habbst 16
Jane Gee Nottingham 35



Her baptism



England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975

Name:Jane Gee Nottingham

Gender:Female

Baptism Date:7 Oct 1832

Baptism Place:Bainton, Northampton, England

Father: Edward Nottingham

Mother:Jane

FHL Film Number:1999015

Reference ID:item 3

Hi Keith

Is this what you are after, I'm a little confused with your last post?



England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975

Name:George Smith Bonser

Gender:Male

Baptism Date:9 Oct 1827

Baptism Place:Glapthorne, Northampton, England

Father: Thomas Bonser

Mother: Mary

FHL Film Number:1999388

Reference ID:p1



England & Wales, National Probate Calendar (Index of Wills and Administrations), 1858-1966

Name:George Smith Bonser <<Farmer

Probate Date:17 Feb 1897

Death Date:10 Dec 1896

Death Place:Northamptonshire, England

Registry:Peterborough


Probate to James Bonser & Charles Pitts, farmers £11955 3s 11d



His wifes probate


England & Wales, National Probate Calendar (Index of Wills and Administrations), 1858-1966

Name:Jane Gee Bonser of: 143 Lincoln Rd

Probate Date:28 Jan 1916

Death Date:24 Nov 1915

Death Place:Peterborough, England

Registry:Peterborough

Probate to: William Edward Sharpe, insurance agent & Thomas Nottingham, farmer £2609 14s 7d

Potty / Derek,
This looks like the Thomas who married Mary Smith - although his age is out: (THIS IS CORRECT)
1851 England Census
about Thomas Bonser

Thomas Bonser
Age:64
Estimated Birth Year:abt 1787 (I HAVE 1785 FOR THE BIRTH)
Relation:Head
Spouse's Name:Mary Bonser
Gender:Male
Where born:Kinoulton, Northamptonshire, England

Thomas Bonser 64
Mary Bonser 61
George Smith Bonser 24
I HAVE A WILLIAM BONSER & SARAH AS MOTHER & FATHER OF THOMAS.
I HAVE A THOMAS AS THOMAS & MARY'S SON BUT HAVE NOT FOUND THE GEORGE RELATION.
I AM ONLY A STANDARD MEMBER AND ARE STRUGGLIG TO NAVIGATE THE SITE.
IT MAY BE ME BUT I CANNOT SEE SOME OF THE SEARCHES YOU HAVE OBVIOUSLY LOOKED AT.
ANY HELP IS GRATEFULLY ACCEPTED.
KIND REGARDS
KEITH :-)

Thank you all for the help with this. I really appreciate your assistance.
Kind regards,
Keith :-)

Let's hope he does come back, Derek!

Potty..I've sent him a PM...asking him to return to his Thread............I hope he does because there is an awful lot of good work totally wasted on here, by loads of people who do not return to their thread..or worse, who DO return to their thread and never acknowledge the work done for them.

Derek.

Agree with you about Ancestry trees, Derek. Have found one today with a girl b1799 marrying in 1804 - maybe that owner isn't good at maths!

Also, the second 1851 I posted is obviously the couple who married in 1812 but until Keith tells us which Thomas he is descended from, we can't tell which of the 1851s is the right family.

Keith.....most of what we've found says Thomas Mary were born about 15 years after your guestimate of 1775.......1791 is hardly c1775..HELP PLEASE!!!

Derek.

Potty..it is unlikely that Thomas and Mary who seem to have had William J in 1827..in Clerkenwell are the same couple who had William in 1814 in Kinoulton.....and I personally treat all trees
on Ancestry with a high degree of suspicion..particularly as most of them are copied wholesale from other trees..thus also copying blatant mistakes.
(One of my hobbies is finding these mistakes)

EDIT...you can discount the Clerkenwell connection completely.according to which..Thomas Bonser is a Salesman..his wife from Churchill...(1851).......The family were are looking at are still in Kinoulton in 1851.....Thomas from Kinoulton Mary from Cropwell Bishop..and they are farmers with several servants.their first two children have moved on and George wa born 1827...significantly with a middle name of Smith.

Derek

This looks like the Thomas who married Mary Smith - although his age is out:


1851 England Census
about Thomas Bonser

Thomas Bonser
Age:64
Estimated Birth Year:abt 1787
Relation:Head
Spouse's Name:Mary Bonser
Gender:Male
Where born:Kinoulton, Northamptonshire, England

Thomas Bonser 64
Mary Bonser 61
George Smith Bonser 24


Civil Parish:
Tansor

County/Island:
Northamptonshire

Country:
England

Baptism for William James:
William James Bonser
Birth Date:6 Jul 1827
Birth Place:Northampton Square Clerkenwell, Middlesex, England
Gender:Male
Event Type:Birth
Father:Thomas Bonser
Mother:Mary Hailes
Denomiation:Presbyterian, Independent or Baptist

Piece Title:
Piece 130: Certificate nos: 2501-3000, Vol 6 (1832 Apr 11-Nov 12

Keith, how have you got back to Thomas, as there were obviously more than one b in Kinoulton.

Thomas and Mary in 1851 - the two Hailes women are unmarried, sister-in-laws and there is a tree on Ancestry who has a Thomas married to Mary Hailes:


1851 England Census
Thomas Bonser

Age:53
Estimated Birth Year:abt 1798
Relation:Head
Spouse's Name:Mary Bonser
Gender:Male
Where born:Kinoulton, Nottinghamshire, England
Civil Parish:Christchurch
County/Island:Middlesex

Thomas Bonser 53
Mary Bonser 67 - b Churchill, Oxon
William James Bonser 23 b Clerkenwell, Middx
Eliza Verling 32
Sarah Rottenborough 16
William Spouler 44
Ann Hailes 83 b Churchill
Sarah Hailes 76 b Churchill

Hello Keith.......just to back up infor from Ginny and Potty:

Thomas Bonser and Mary had at least two children baptised at Kinoulton..one of several small villages within a few miles of each other,,including Cropwell Bishop. Cropwell Butler and Whysall among others:

William 27.11.1814
Mary 13.10.1816

All the best

Derek.

If the above is your Thomas, this could be his baptism:


England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
Thomas Bonser
Gender:Male
Baptism Date:6 Jan 1793
Baptism Place:Kinoulton,Nottingham,England
Father: John Bonser
Mother: Ann
FHL Film Number:462987, 504064, 504518