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Sorry, you have said she states maiden name is Phillips on marriage certificate, and father's surname Phillips on death certificate.

Where does she state 'Carroll' - could you tell us which censuses?

Thank-you

Thank-you for your explanation, Margie.

Is this your grandparents' marriage, and, if so, have you got the certificate?

Marriages Jun 1886
HEAD Thomas Dartford 2a 695
PHILLIPS Mary Dartford 2a 695

Thank-you.

Added:
If her maiden name is Carroll on your father's birth certificate. then you need a marriage between 1877 and 1885 of Mary Ann Carroll to Mr Phillips,

If she lied about her age, then depends who married who?
Marriages Mar 1876
Carroll Mary Ann Shoreditch 1c 263
Hayes Caroline Shoreditch 1c 263
Herbert Garrett Shoreditch 1c 263
Phillips Alfred Shoreditch 1c 263

Here is info that I have and know it is 100% correct as I have my father's birth certificate and his marriage certificate .IT APPEARS AS IF MY GRANDMOTHER WAS MARRIED ONCE BEFORE SHE MARRIED MY GRANDFATHER WHICH EXPLAINS THE TWO NAMES YET THERE IS NO RECORD OF A MARY ANN PHILLIPS MARRYING A CARROLL.

MY FATHERS NAMES WAS( THOMAS RICHARD HEAD 1889) BORN IN DARTFORD ENGLAND/ DIED IN CANADA / SERVED IN THE 1ST WORLD WAR .HE WAS MARRIED THREE TIMES BUT NO RECORD OR NAME OF HIS 1ST WIFE.HE WAS A WIDOWER WHEN HE CAME TO CANADA AND HE MARRIED BERYL BIDDLE IN 1923 HERE IN CANADA.WE THINK HE MAY HAVE MARRIED THE 1ST WIFE WHILE IN THE WAR.

MY GRANDFATHER WAS THOMAS RICHARD HEAD AND HE WAS BORN IN 1865 IN DARTFORD ENGLAND. WOULD LOVE TO KNOW HOW HE DIED AND WHEN .HE MARRIED MARY ANN CARROL (PHILLIPS)IN 1886 .

MARY ANN PHILLIPS WAS BORN IN 1861 IN KENT ENGLAND AND SHE DIED IN CANADA .SHE HAD TWO CHILDREN WITH THOMAS AND THEY WERE (MY DAD-THOMAS RICHARD HEAD AND ADA HEAD(1893).BOTH BORN IN ENGLAND.

I REALLY HOPE TO GET SOME INFO ON MARY ANNS PARENTS BUT IT IS NOT LOOKING GOOD.JUST DO NOT KNOW HOW TO FIND THEM . I AM NOT GIVING UP JUST YET THOUGH.

THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT TO ME AND I HAVE TO KEEP LOOKING BECAUSE I REALLY WANT TO BUILD THE FAMILY TREE . I DEAL WITH SEVERE PHYSICAL PAIN AND EMOTIONAL PAIN ON A DAILY BASIS AND DOING RESEARCH IS ONE THING I ENJOY DOING.MY DAD WAS MY BEST FRIEND AND I ADORED HIM .HE TOOK A PART OF ME WITH HIM WHEN HE DIED.

MY MOTHER WAS ALWAYS MAD AT ME AND SHE NEVER EVER TOLD ME "SHE LOVED ME". THERE WERE NO HUGS OR KISSES,NO BEDTIME STORIES,NO PRAISES FROM HER AND SHE ALWAYS SAID"I CURSED THE DAY YOU WERE BORN AND WISHED YOU NEVER WERE". IF A PERSONS OWN MOTHER COULD NOT LOVE THEM THEN THEY MUST HAVE BEEN BORN FROM A BAD SEED.BEING SEVERELY ABUSED ALL MY LIFE BY OTHERS HAS LEFT ME FEELING LIKE I AM TRASH. I WILL DIE FEELING LIKE I AM TRASH AND SHOULD NOT HAVE BEEN BORN.

MY FATHER ALWAYS SHOWED HE LOVED ME AND HE WAS MY ONE JOY IN LIFE . I MISS HIM SO VERY MUCH. MY PARENTS HAD EIGHT CHILDREN TOGETHER.

THANKS FOR WANTING TO HELP ME FIND MY GRAND MOTHERS PARENTS . MY NAME IS : MARGIE

HI THOMAS

PLEASE CAN YOU POST THE CENSUS RECORDS WHERE MARY ANN APPEARS WITH THE SURNAME OF "CARROLL"

OF........IF YOU CAN TELL US WHERE SHE IS, WE CAN TAKE A LOOK.

I CAN'T FIND A MARRIAGE ENTRY FOR A MARY ANN PHILLIPS TO A CARROLL.

PRICKLES.

Have you already traced back on your father's paternal side?

1891 census - Blackwall Lane - Greenwich
Thomas Head - head - 26 - general labourer - Dartford
Mary Head - wife - 30 - Dartford
Thomas R. Head - son - 2 - Dartford

1871 census - South Street, Dartford
Richard Head - head - 35 - labourer in brickfield - Swanley
Mary Ann Head - wife - 33 - Crockenhill
Richard Head - son - 11 - scholar - Dartford
Doreas Head - dau - 10 - scholar - Dartford
Thomas Head - son - 5 - Dartford
Ada Head - dau - 1 - Dartford
John Head - son - 3 mons - Dartford

Looks to be born in Greenwich and answers No to whether he is married

Canada, Soldiers of the First World War, 1914-1918 about Thomas Richard Head
Name: Thomas Richard Head
Birth Date: 1 Jan 1888
Birth Location: Erunwich Kint, England
Relative: Mrs Thomas Head
Regiment Number: 27669

Got birth year wrong??
He joined in 1914, he had already had experience in the RAMC and the RHA, his profession was shipper, and his address was 90 Russell House, Yonge Street, Toronto (or similar)

Do you know where and when Thomas Richard Head, 1865, died, and is this Thomas 1889 after war service?

Thomas R Head
Date of Arrival: 31 Mar 1919
Vessel: Empress of Britain
Search Ship Database: View the 'Empress of Britain' in the 'Passenger Ships and Images' database
Port of Arrival: St.John, New Brunswick
Port of Departure: Halifax, Nova Scotia
Roll: T-14837

rank: Private, Dependant: Mother

I wonder if this is just a coincidence:
1881 England Census
Name:Mary Ann Phillips
Age:17
Estimated Birth Year:abt 1864
Relationship to Head:Sister
Dartford, Kent, England
Civil Parish:Woolwich
County/Island:London
Country:England

Street Address:1 Albert Street
Occupation:Dress Maker

Maria W. Piddle 24 - it is Biddle on the image
Sidney T. K. Piddle
Mary Ann Phillips 17

Passenger Lists leaving UK 1890-1960 Transcription
First Name: EVANGELINE Last Name: BIDDLE Title: - Age Transcribed: 47 Year: 1923 Departure Month: 7 Departure Day: 13 Ship name: MONTCALM Ship Departure Port: LIVERPOOL Destination Port: QUEBEC State: - Country: CANADA Destination: QUEBEC Destination Place Country: CANADA Gender: Female Marital Status: - Occupation: HOUSEWIFE Year Of Birth: 1876 Birth Month: - Birth Day: - Country Of Birth: - Last Residence Country: - UK Address: - Ship Official Number: 145903 Ship Master's First Name: - Ship Master's Surname: RENNIE Ship Master's Title: CAPT Shipping line: CANADIAN PACIFIC City: LIVERPOOL Ship Destination Port: MONTREAL Ship Destination Country: CANADA

With her is..

Frank Herbert (Obviously should be Norbert) Biddle...20 (Farming)
Eileen Lois Biddle...16 (Domestic)


Passenger Lists leaving UK 1890-1960 Transcription
First Name: FRANK Last Name: BIDDLE Title: - Age Transcribed: 46 Year: 1923 Departure Month: 3 Departure Day: 23 Ship name: MONTCALM Ship Departure Port: LIVERPOOL Destination Port: SAINT JOHN NB State: - Country: CANADA Destination: SAINT JOHN NB Destination Place Country: CANADA Gender: Male Marital Status: - Occupation: GARDENER Year Of Birth: 1877 Birth Month: - Birth Day: - Country Of Birth: - Last Residence Country: - UK Address: - Ship Official Number: - Ship Master's First Name: - Ship Master's Surname: RENNIE Ship Master's Title: CAPT Shipping line: CANADIAN PACIFIC City: LIVERPOOL Ship Destination Port: SAINT JOHN NB Ship Destination Country: CANADA

Any information on a certificate depends on who is giving the information and what 'truth' they have been told or whether they want to lie.

So if something is unknown they might not know, they might not want to say, or they have been given incorrect information.

So a death certificate is highly suspect - some of my children would struggle with my parents' names or my place of birth.

A census filled in by a husband depends on him being told the correct information by his wife - so could be suspect,

etc etc.

Could you post those Carroll censuses?

Thanks

Welcome to the boards Thomas.

Household transcription
1911 census

Person: BIDDLE, Beryl Evangeline
Address: Headley Heath Kingsnorton

BIDDLE, Frank Head Married M 34 1877 Wood Working Machinist Warwickshire Bham
BIDDLE, Evangeline Wife Married 11 years F 34 1877 Warwickshire Bham
BIDDLE, Beryl Evangeline Daughter F 10 1901 School Staffs Wolverhampton
BIDDLE, Frank Norbert Son M 8 1903 School Staffs Smethwick
BIDDLE, Eileen Lois Daughter F 3 1908 Warwickshire Greet
RG number: RG14
Piece: 17827
Reference: RG14PN17827 RG78PN1091 RD383 SD1 ED4 SN3
Registration District: Kings Norton
Sub District: Kings Norton
Enumeration District: 4
Parish: Kings Norton
Address: Headley Heath Kingsnorton
County: Worcestershire
(3 children born and living)


Birmingham, England, Marriages and Banns, 1754-1937
about Francis Biddle (Bachelor) Cabinet Maker
Gender: Male
Birth Year: abt 1876
Marriage Date: 18 Sep 1899
Marriage Age: 23
Marriage Place: Deritend, St John The Baptist, Warwickshire, England
Spouse: Evangeline Swingler (Spinster)
Spouse Gender: Female
Spouse Marriage Age: 23
Father: Joseph Frederick Biddle (Cabinet Maker)
Spouse's Father: Elkanah Swingler (French Polisher)
Witnesses: Frances Lancelot Admas and Alice Coomby.
Reference Number: DRO 1
Archive Roll: 611

None of these dates add up..............here is Tho's wife, arriving after her marriage to him!



Canada, Ocean Arrivals (Form 30A), 1919-1924

Name:Beryl Biddle

Gender:Female

Estimated Birth Year:abt 1902

Birth Place:Wolverhampton, England

Age:22

Date of Arrival:Nov 1924

Port of Arrival:Quebec

Port of Departure:London, England

Ship Name:Melita

Father: Frank Biddle


Hang on, this looks like her



UK, Outward Passenger Lists, 1890-1960

Name:Beryl Biddle

Gender:Female

Age:22

Birth Date:abt 1900

Departure Date:26 Oct 1922

Port of Departure:Southampton, England

Destination Port:Quebec, Canada

Ship Name:Melita

Search Ship Database:Search the 'Melita' in the 'Passenger Ships and Images' database

Shipping Line:Canadian Pacific Railway

Official Number:136367

Master:Captain G Hamilton

Is this your father with his mother?



1921 Census of Canada

Name:Thomas Head

Gender:Male

Marital Status:Widowed

Age:32

Birth Year:abt 1889

Birth Place:England

Relation to Head of House:Head

Father Birth Place:England

Mother's Name:Mary Head

Mother Birth Place:England

Year of Immigration:1907

Racial or Tribal Origin:English

Province or Territory:Ontario

District:Northumberland

District Number:107

Sub-District:Hamilton (Township)

Sub-District Number:23

City, Town or Village:Hamilton Township

Street or Township:Hamilton Tp

Municipality:Hamilton

Occupation:Laborer


Name

Thomas Head 32
Mary Head 62


On the above census he is listed as a widow but the marriage is after that date! Maybe he married before?


Ontario, Canada, Marriages, 1801-1928

Name:Thomas Richard Head

Birth Place:England

Age:34

Estimated Birth Year:abt 1889

Father Name:Thos Head

Mother Name:Mary Carroll

Spouse Name:Beryl Biddle

Spouse's Age:23

Spouse Birth Year:abt 1900

Spouse Birth Place:England

Spouse Father Name:Frank Biddle

Spouse Mother Name:Evevgslin Swingter

Marriage Date:12 May 1923

Marriage County or District:Northumberland

Registration District:Northumberland

Her arrival in Canada, but I can't see Mary on the list:

Ada Head
Gender: Female
Age: 14
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1893
Date of Arrival: 13 May 1907
Vessel: Kensington
Search Ship Database: View the 'Kensington' in the 'Passenger Ships and Images' database
Port of Arrival: Montreal, Quebec
Port of Departure: Liverpool, England
Roll: T-489

Travelling with Ada is Mary - which would tie in with the death cert and the 1921 census where Mary is with son Thomas:

Ada Head
Gender: Female
Age: 17
Birth Date: abt 1890
Departure Date: 5 Feb 1907
Port of Departure: Liverpool, England
Destination Port: Quebec, Canada
Ship Name: Kensington
Search Ship Database: Search the 'Kensington' in the 'Passenger Ships and Images' database
Master: W Roberts

Is this the daughter that is mentioned on Mary's death cert



Ontario, Canada, Marriages, 1801-1928

Name:Ada Mary Head

Father Name:Deceaded Mary Head

Mother Name:Phillips Head

Spouse Name:John Sanderson

Spouse's Age:30

Spouse Birth Year:abt 1877

Spouse Father Name:James Sanderson

Spouse Mother Name:Mary Davies

Marriage Date:16 Jul 1909

Marriage County or District:York

This look like Ada ,s birth


Civil Registration event: Birth

Print Close
Name: HEAD, Ada Mary
Registration district: Greenwich
County: London
Year of registration: 1892
Quarter of registration: Jul-Aug-Sep
Mother's maiden name: Not available before 1911 Q3
Volume no: 1D
Page nos 1122

Is this her going to Canada ?


Britain: outbound passenger lists leaving UK 1890-1960 - person transcript

Print Close
Name: Mrs Mary HEAD
Date of departure: 10 October 1919
Port of departure: Avonmouth
Destination port: Montreal
Destination country: Canada
Date of Birth: 1860 (calculated from age)
Age: 59
Marital Status:
Sex: Female
Occupation:
Notes:
Passenger recorded on: Page 7 of 15
Ship: PRETORIAN
Official Number: 113969
Master's name: J Hall
Steamship Line: Canadian Pacific Railway Atlantic Steamship Line
Where bound: Quebec, Canada
Square feet: 5750
Registered tonnage: 4842.58
Passengers on voyage: 441

1901 census

Name: Mary Head
Age: 40
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1861
Relation to Head: Wife
Gender: Female
Spouse: Thomas Head
Birth Place: Dartford, Kent, England
Civil Parish: Dartford
Town: Dartford
County/Island: Kent
Country: England
Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status:

View Image
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
Thomas Head 36
Mary Head 40
Thomas Head 12
Ada Head 8


So she is consistently born. c1861 Dartford


Not picking her up as Carroll on any census

On the death certificate it also gives the informant as Ada Sanderson - daughter


Ontario, Canada, Deaths, 1869-1938 and Deaths Overseas, 1939-1947


Name:Mary Head[Mary Phillips]

Death Date:26 Oct 1937

Death County or District:York

Death State:Ontario

Death Country:Canada

Age:76 <<DOB Jan 15th 1861

Gender:Female

Estimated Birth Year:abt 1861

Birth Location:England

Father:Phillips