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From Bob

Hope these facts help.

When Joseph Beloudy (1740 - 1805) married Anna Gilfoy on 11th or 16th Sept 1770 he had to pay a £200 bond, a considerable amount even in those days!! This was probably because Anna was a minor - he was 29/30 at the time - and he had to pay to show good faith and testify that he wasn't already married. In other words she must have been at least 10 maybe 12 years younger than him at marriage.

Therefore it is entirely probable that Mary Ann Beloudy b.1795 (married Thomas Wallace Prosser in 1812) was the daughter of Joseph and Anna, who would have been 43/45 in 1795 and still of child-bearing age.

Also Joseph had another daughter Elizabeth b.1786 who married Edward Ryan on 6th July 1800. She was pregnant by Ryan, who had been taken on by Beloudy in 1796 - indentured 15th April 1796 - as an apprentice. In February 1800 Beloudy legally rescinded the apprenticeship because of Ryan's infidelity with his 14 year old daughter and tried to end their relationship believing Ryan incapable of maintaining Elizabeth financially. Despite his opposition Elizabeth and Edward still married 5 months later.

Yes, would also think the 1758 one...

(wonder if the Will would give the odd answer. lol)

Chris :)

Hmm so that is the Clerkenwell one... I am thinking the one born c1740 might have been too old to be Mary's father and perhaps he is more likely the other one b. c1758...very confusing!

a google search of beloudy collier street, brings up a few items.
(does look like Collier Street on Burial image)


UK, Register of Duties Paid for Apprentices' Indentures, 1710-1811
about Josh Beloudy
Master's Name: Josh Beloudy
Apprentice Name: Edwd Ryan (who married Elizabeth Beloudy, perhaps!)
Residence Location: Clerkenwell
Payment Date: 15 Apr 1796

Master's Name: Jos Beloudy
Apprentice Name: M A J Mitchel
Residence Location: St John Clerkenwell, Middlesex
Payment Date: 5 Aug 1785

Chris :)

edits (another Daughter)

Pallot's Marriage Index for England: 1780 - 1837
about Cathe Beloudy
Name: Cathe Beloudy
Spouse: Wm Langshaw
Marriage Date: 1796
Parish: St. Pancras

Thanks Chris! Good spotting on that 1805 burial. Makes him born c1740.

It looks like the one who died in 1838 is the one born Germany c1758 so might need to get the 1805 will to work out who was the one with the daughters!

London, England, Baptisms, Marriages and Burials, 1538-1812
Name: Joseph Belandy
Burial Date: Feb 3rd 1805
Parish: St James, Pentonville
County: Middlesex
Borough: Islington
Record Type: Burial
Register Type: Parish Register
(64yrs)

(wonder if this is the 1805 one)

Chris :)

Burial
Surname:Beloudy
Forenames:Joseph
Supplied Forename:Jos
Year of burial:1838
Age at death:79
Place:Westminster
Dedication:St Paul Covent Garden
County:Middlesex
Record source:Boyd's London Burials 1538-1872

(the above on Find My Past)

Chris :)

(also below Marriages)

Groom's First names:John
Groom's surname:Green
Groom's parish:St Martin In The Fields
Groom's Age:
Marriage year:1799
Marriage month:Sep
Marriage day:10
Parish:St Martin In The Fields
County:Middlesex
Bride's First names:Ann
Bride's surname:Beloudy
Bride's parish:St Martin In The Fields
Bride's Age:
Data provider:Westminster Archives

Groom's First names:Edward
Groom's surname:Rein
Groom's parish:Saint Anne
Groom's Age:
Marriage year:1800
Marriage month:Jul
Marriage day:06
Parish:St Anne, Soho
County:Middlesex
Bride's First names:Elizabeth
Bride's surname:Beloudy
Bride's parish:Saint Anne
Bride's Age
Data provider:Westminster Archives

Just to clarify, did Joseph Beloudy die in 1805 (date of will) or 1838?

Awesome! :) thanks Quoy and Kucinta.

Looks like the other children may be correct then.

You can buy and view online the 1805 will Quoy found for Joseph Beloudy at The National Archives site for £3.36:


http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/SearchUI/details/D368106?descriptiontype=Full&ref=PROB+11/1420/99

No idea if this is relevant, but Joseph was an organ builder and the marriage bond was for £200 . Ann was a minor, and her father Cornelius Gylfoy was a salesman:

London and Surrey, England, Marriage Bonds and Allegations, 1597-1921

Name: Joseph Beloudy
Event Date: 11 Sep 1770
Parish: St Giles In The Fields
County: Middlesex
Spouse's Name: Ann Gytfory
Event Type: Bond
Reference Number: DL/A/D/24/MS 10091E/83

Looks like Gylfoy on the document

Pallot's Baptism Index for England: 1780 - 1837

Name: Helen Henrietta Prosser
Baptism Date: 1827
Parent 1: Thos Prosser
Parent 2: MaryProsser
Parish: St. Pancras
County: Middlesex

Pallot's Baptism Index for England: 1780 - 1837

Name: Maria Prosser
Baptism Date: 1816
Parent 1: Thos Prosser
Parent 2: MaryProsser
Parish: St. Pancras
County: Middlesex

Thought you might like this
from a tree on Ancestry
Mary Ann Beloudy daughter of Joseph Beloudy born 1758 Bayern, Germany
died 1838 london ,


The Morning Chronicle (London, England), Wednesday, October 27, 1819;

for auction a Beloudy street Organ

but then I found this
Will of Joseph Beloudy, Organ Builder of Pentonville , Middlesex 18 February 1805



Joseph Beloudy, who is recorded at Lekin Lane, Drury Lane in 1784


Joseph Beloudy or Bellondie of Clerkenwell. (ref. 34) Both Beloudy and King feature in lists of British organ-builders.

Thanks Christina, Londonbelle and Kucinta! :-) :-) :-)

This adds some credence to my dates for TW snr and Mary Ann.

The confusing part is that TW jnr married a Marianne!

It does seem he and his eldest 2 children (Ellen, I had her in my tree b. c1851, estimated from her age at death, and Wallace, ditto for c1854) were baptised on the same day.

I guess this means it is likely his siblings were not baptised either :-(

So we only have eldest Robert chr. 1813, and then a BIG gap to Thomas in 1828!

It does appear Anna Margaret may be a sister; would be good to find her baptism but it may not exist!

I have just found a tree that gives the following children between Robert & Thos:
Maria b/chr 1816
Sarah b 1818, chr 1821
John b/chr 1819
Emma b/chr 1820
George b/chr 1825
Helen Henrietta b/chr 1827

Can anyone see them in the records please, to verify them? I guess Anna Margaret might fit in the gap between Emma & George...

Odd that TW jnr is shown as a plasterer, later he was a 'Master Music Printer' on certs! But it does all add up. Thanks again.

Name: Mary Ann Prosser
Record Type: Death
Estimated Death Date: 1878
Age: 83
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1795
Parish or Poor Law Union: Shoreditch
Borough: Hackney
Register Type: Parish Register

Died in the infirmary of the parish of St Leonard's Shoreditch on 22.4.78. Paralysis

Name: Thomas Wallis Prosser
Baptism Date: 29 Jan 1797
Parish: St Mary, Whitechapel
County: Middlesex
Borough: Tower Hamlets
Parent(s): Robert, Elizabeth
Record Type: Baptism
Register Type: Parish Register

Born Sept 25th 1793

I wonder if Wheeler is a mistranscription of Wallace.


First names: Robert
Surname: Prosser
Baptism year: 1813
Baptism month: May
Baptism day: 23
Parish: St Clement Danes
County: Middlesex
Page: 16
Birth year: -
Birth month: -
Birth day: -
Father's First names: Thomas Wheeler
Mother's First names: Mary Ann
Record source: Westminster Baptisms- Transcripts
Data provider: Westminster Archives

Wonder if this is Anna Margaret with her son James in 1871....


1871 England Census
Name: Hannah Stocker
Age: 45
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1826
Relation: Head
Gender: Female
Where born: St Clement, Middlesex, England
Civil parish: St Pancras
Ecclesiastical parish: St Mary Magdalene
County/Island: London
Country: England
Registration district: Pancras
Sub-registration district: Regent
ED, institution, or vessel: 18a
Household schedule number: 86
Piece: 204
Folio: 95
Page Number: 15
Household Members: Name Age
Hannah Stocker 45 .....Head.....Widow.......no occupation listed.
James Stocker 8....Son.....St Pancras.

Looks like another child of Thomas Wallace again baptized on 19 May 1854

Name: Wallace Prosser
Record Type: Baptism
Baptism Date: 19 May 1854
Father's Name: Thomas Wallace Prosser occ Plasterer
Mother's Name: Marianne Prosser
Parish or Poor Law Union: St Pancras
Borough: Camden
Register Type: Parish Registers
Address: Tudor Place