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and of course the only way to find such info is by tracing backward through records to try to find the ancestors and their origins ... there is no magic genealogy wand to wave to find whether someone entered the country in the 1700s or 1600s since no such records ever existed ... and no one here has a secret trove of information about Donatis in England ...

David Donatty born c1788, with his first wife Mary, seems to be the father of Thomas

Name: Thomas Donatty
Gender: Male
Christening Date: 17 May 1816
Christening Place: SAINT MATTHEW,BETHNAL GREEN,LONDON,ENGLAND
Birth Date: 24 Aug 1808
>> Father's Name: David Donatty
Father's Birthplace:
Father's Age:
Mother's Name: Mary

David appears to have had second wife Ann and later partnered with Jane (while Ann was still living)

he also had son David baptised 1821 with second wife Ann (you don't appear to have known about his other marriage and children?)

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:NP36-WMQ
Name David Donatty
Gender Male
Christening Date 12 Aug 1821
Christening Place SAINT CLEMENT DANES,WESTMINSTER,LONDON,ENGLAND
Father's Name David Donatty
Mother's Name Ann

as I said

'(son) David's 1845 marriage certificate should state father's name and occupation, which might match to the 1841 or 1851 census for the elder David'

this could give you information about Thomas's father ... the David who appears to be him in the censuses who is shown in 1851 as born in Aldgate City


searching for the surname Donati at familysearch for instance does not offer great help

if you restrict the search to Italy 1600-1800, say, you do see a few families, and some similar names

but there is just no way to connect them to the family in England that I can see

I am curious about David being baptised in 1817 after his second marriage in 1814, before the birth of his (apparently) first child to that marriage, Mary Ann, later in 1817

I wonder whether it might indicate he was formerly Roman Catholic, would anyone here have any idea?

Thanks so far for all the help so far it seems to be going back the real search I want to continue if anyone can help is to clarify the name and did some one immigrate from Italy Spain or France with that name.

ArgyllGran that 1782 birth info is taken from a tree posted at familysearch

malyon you need to be clearer about sources

I always think that links to info help, when so easily available, and especially when the info posted is in such an incomprehensible form!

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/2:1:M4XG-GLR

he is shown as father of Thomas 1808-1874

he is shown with dates 1782- (blank)
and the info shows place of birth: Aldgate, , London, England

but there seems to be no baptism record at familysearch, and no source is stated in the tree



there is this as ArgyllGran posted
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:NP52-5LR

Name David Donatty
Gender Male
> Christening Date 30 Mar 1817
Christening Place SAINT MATTHEW,BETHNAL GREEN,LONDON,ENGLAND
> Birth Date 12 Nov 1788

I'd say in contemplation of marriage but he had Thomas before that

he could have been ill and been baptised in contemplation of death but survived
possibly
http://kdfhs.org.uk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1&Itemid=30
epidemics timeline
1817 - ‘the Irish disease’ (probably typhus) London 1 in 14 died


1851 census shows a David aged 65, born Aldgate
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:SGTF-SLM

here is Ancestry record

Name: David Donatti - occupation Hawker
Age: 65
Estimated birth year: abt 1786
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Jane Donatti aged 47
Where born: Aldgate City
Civil Parish: St Clement Danes
County/Island: Middlesex
> Registration district: Strand

so he is in all likelihood the one who died in 1852

Deaths Dec 1852
DONATHY David > Strand 1b 246

assuming that the surname is spelled as someone thought it was

(and that might be the reason for the question about Scottish origin, as surnames Donathy / Donathey in censuses originate Ireland, Scotland, Cumberland ... i.e. could be a matter of pronunciation

but to adopt an Italianate spelling later seems odd)


only problem with the 1851 is that it shows wife Jane, and the tree at familysearch shows wife Mary as mother of son Thomas

in 1841 David Donatty, 50, toll collector, at the same address as 1851 (Clements Court) is without a wife and in a household that includes Jane Kent, 35, no occupation



malyon has posted this, which I will make comprehensible, and again apparently comes from a tree at familyseach

Jane Isabella CUTHBERT
BIRTH 1799 Westminster, , London, England
DEATH 1866 Holborn, , London, England
SPOUSE Thomas DONATI
MARRIAGE 30 May 1830 Westminster, , London, England

the marriage record itself is at
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:NKN8-Z3N

so that is her death in 1866 and she is not Jane, David's wife, she is Thomas's (considerably older) wife

Deaths Jun 1866
Donatti Jane I 67 Holborn 1b 410

and we are still missing the Jane who shows as David's wife in 1851


but what of the other David Donatty who was having children with wife Ann in the same time and place
Mary Ann baptised Nov 1817
David baptised August 1821

>> OR is that the same father of Thomas (Thomas born 1808 and baptised 1816)
who had remarried to Ann, and got baptised himself in 1817

I suspect so

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:V5KQ-CMQ

Name David Donatty
Spouse's Name Ann Ellis
Event Date 16 Jul 1814
Event Place Saint Helen Bishopsgate,London,London,England


so one David Donatty with 1, 2, 3 wives? if he did marry Jane

Deaths Jun 1856 ?
Kent Jane Strand 1b 267

this would seem likely to be David who was born 1821

Marriages Jun 1845
Donatti David Shoreditch 2 351 *

* and the postem to that record says

'05/08/2007 later family spelling DONATI'

very unfortunately with no contact info left

David's 1845 marriage certificate should state father's name and occupation, which might match to the 1841 or 1851 census for the elder David


the same postem is attached to this record:

Deaths Jun 1851
Donatty Ann London 2 109

which could be David's second wife's death and the reason he was not married to #3 Jane

aha yes - in 1851 - no marital status is stated for either mother Ann or daughter Mary Ann

Name: Mary Ann Donatti
Age: 32
Estimated birth year: abt 1819 ( = baptised Nov 1817, daughter of David and Ann)
Relation: Daughter
Mother's name: Ann Donatti, born c1784, place unknown, upholsterer
Where born: London, Middlesex, England
Civil Parish: St Andrew Undershaft
Ecclesiastical parish: London
Town: Aldgate
Ann Donatti 65
Mary Ann Donatti 32
Thomas H Donatti 5
Ann Parker 40 visitor
Louisa Pitt 46 visitor

Ann and Mary Ann are also together in 1841

found it on family search

Malyon posted birth of David Donatty 1782. Where did you find that, Malyon? Is that definitely him?

If not, here's a David Donatty in Bethnal Green 1788, which is where Thomas was christened - another possibility:

David Donatty

England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
birth: 12 November 1788
christening:30 March 1817
SAINT MATTHEW, BETHNAL GREEN, LONDON, ENGLAND



Don't know if this is the same man or not:

David Donatty
England Deaths and Burials, 1538-1991
birth: 1785
burial: 19 October 1852
St. Andrew'S, Holborn, Middlesex, England
residence: Little Grays Inn Lane

You have to remember the name was changed to Donati, but the farther back in time you go it appears to be Donatty.

Rose

Had a PM. and replied that I have no family connection so can't help on the origin of t he name

Suggested looking in family search to see if the family, pre reg of 1837, can be found

David DONATTY father of thomas
View Tree
GENDER

Male
BIRTH

1782

mother of thomas
Mary
View Tree
GENDER

Female
BIRTH

1786

Jane Isabella CUTHBERT
View Tree
GENDER

Female
BIRTH

1799
Westminster, , London, England
DEATH

1866
Holborn, , London, England
MARRIAGES (1)

SPOUSE

Thomas DONATI
MARRIAGE

30 May 1830
Westminster, , London, England

seems like its an italian name

https://www.houseofnames.com/donati-family-crest/Italian

I have replied to today would like to inquire if you know the family at all and if they are English or of other origin I think possible Italian or if you could point me in the direction to find this out.
Regards Clive Barton

Dad

THOMAS
Last name DONATTI
Gender Male
Birth day -
Birth month -
Birth year 1808
Age 66
Death quarter 3
Death year 1874
District HOLBORN
County London
Volume 1B
Page 376
Country England
Record set England & Wales deaths 1837-2007

The actual marriage cert is on ancestry.

Record Image View
Add alternate information
Report issue
Name: Robert Donati
Spouse: Marion East
Record Type: Marriage
Event Date: 17 Oct 1861
Parish: Parish Chapel, St Pancras
Borough: Camden
Father Name: Thomas Donatti occ artist
Spouse Father: William East
Register Type: Parish Register

ROBERT
Last name DONATI
Marriage quarter 4
Marriage year 1861
Registration month -
MarriageFinder™ ROBERT DONATI married one of these people
MARION EAST
District PANCRAS
District number -
County London
Country England
Volume 1B
Page 74
Record set England & Wales marriages 1837-2008
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
Subcategory Marriages & divorces
Collections from Great Britain
© brightsolid online publishing ltd




First name(s) Robert
Last name Donati
Name note -
Marriage year 1861
Marriage date 17 Oct 1861
Marriage place Old Church,Saint Pancras,London,England
Father's first name(s) -
Father's last name -
Mother's first name(s) -
Mother's last name -
Spouse's first name(s) Marion
Spouse's last name East
Spouse's father's first name(s) -
Spouse's father's last name -
Spouse's mother's first name(s) -
Spouse's mother's last name -
Place Saint Pancras
County London
Country England
Record set England Marriages 1538-1973
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
Subcategory Marriages & divorces
Collections from Great Britain
Index (c) IRI. Used by permission of FamilySearch Intl

1881 census

Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
3, St Pauls Terrace, St Pancras, Pancras, London, England

Learn more

Print transcription View image Household Members
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Gender Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Robert Donati Head Married Male 41 1840 Pianoforte Maker Marylebone, Middlesex, England Transcription
Marion Donati Wife Married Female 37 1844 - St Pancras, Middlesex, England Transcription
Thomas Edward Donati Son Single Male 18 1863 Organ Builder St Pancras, Middlesex, England Transcription
Florence A Donati Daughter Single Female 14 1867 - St Pancras, Middlesex, England Transcription
Louisa T Donati Daughter Single Female 13 1868 Scholar St Pancras, Middlesex, England Transcription
Clara Donati Daughter Single Female 11 1870 Scholar St Pancras, Middlesex, England Transcription
Maud Donati Daughter Single Female 7 1874 Scholar St Pancras, Middlesex, England Transcription
Emily Donati Daughter Single Female 6 1875 Scholar St Pancras, Middlesex, England Transcription
George Gough Lodger Single Male 34

1871 census

Scotland Census Transcription
43 Castle Road, St Pancras, Pancras, London, England

Robert Donati Head - Male 32 pianoforte maker born Holborn

1861 census

England &Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
17, Harpur Street, St George the Martyr, Holborn, London, England


Thomas Donatti Head Married Male 53 1808 Interior Decorator London, Middlesex, England Transcription
Jane I Donatti Wife Married Female 61 1800 - Westminster, Middlesex, England Transcription
John T Donatti Son Unmarried Male 23 1838 Artist Decorative St Marylebone, Middlesex, England Transcription
Robert Donatti Son Unmarried Male 21 1840 Piano Fort Finisher St Marylebone, Middlesex, England Transcription
Sarah A Donatti Niece Unmarried Female 13 1848 - Shoreditch, Middlesex, England Transcription
Raphael Ciseci Lodger Unmarried Male 37

Here they are on the 1841 census


1841 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Wyndham Street, St Marylebone, Marylebone, Middlesex, England

Learn more

Print transcription View image Household Members
First name(s) Last name Gender Age Birth year Birth place
John Price Male 45 1796 Middlesex, England Transcription
Mary Price Female 45 1796 Middlesex, England Transcription
John Price Male 20 1821 Middlesex, England Transcription
Louisa Price Female 15 1826 Middlesex, England Transcription
Mary Price Female 15 1826 Middlesex, England Transcription
Susan Price Female 15 1826 Middlesex, England Transcription
Thomas Price Male 12 1829 Middlesex, England Transcription
Caroline Price Female 7 1834 Middlesex, England Transcription
George Price Male 4 1837 Middlesex, England Transcription
Ellen Price Female 1 1840 Middlesex, England Transcription
James Froyer Male 15 1826 Middlesex, England Transcription
Jane Thornton Female 60 1781 Middlesex, England Transcription
Sarah Thornton Female 45 1796 Middlesex, England Transcription

Thomas Donatty Male 35 1806 Middlesex, Occ Artest
Jane Donatty Female 40 1801 Middlesex,
Frederick Donatty Male 5 1836 Middlesex
John Donatty Male 4 1837 Middlesex,
Robert Donatty Male 2 1839 Middlesex,
All born in County

Richard Tonks Male 35 1806 - Transcription

Is this Thomas?

Name: Thomas Donatty
Gender: Male
Christening Date: 17 May 1816
Christening Place: SAINT MATTHEW,BETHNAL GREEN,LONDON,ENGLAND
Birth Date: 24 Aug 1808
Father's Name: David Donatty
Father's Birthplace:
Father's Age:
Mother's Name: Mary


Rose

He was actually born as Donatty in 1839.

Births Sep 1839
Donatty Robert Marylebone 1 177

Rose