General Chat

Hi Debbie, Can sympathise with you. My youngest son is 17 months old and wakes up 2-3 times a night still. My daughter who is 6 woke up at least 5 times when she was a baby and then didn't sleep through the night until about 3 yrs! I think I was lucky with my middle son he slept through the night from birth. All I can say is they will grow out of it. Zoe

Debbie My grandmother who had 13 (how did they cope) Said she used to turn the cot so the baby was facing the moon. She reckoned it worked everytime. Be very very careful using Phenergan speak to you Doctor or Pharmacist first. I seem to remember a few years back that sedatives used for infants were linked to cot deaths don't know if it was substaniated but beware. Good Luck Pat

It's amazing what a parent will put up with isn't it? I do hope that your partners are helping out and taking their fair share too. I have little to add to what's been said already except that it seems to me that you really have to start from day one when you get home from the delivery. Routine was unfashionable for years but most babies need to feel warm and secure, and a routine is a part of that. This problem may be a result of our modern life with both parents working to support a huge mortgage. We have friends who keep their babies up in the evening because that is the only time they see them. Or worse - they put them to bed early then, when they wake at 10-o-clock get them up and play with them. You can't blame them but they are making, as they say, a rod for their own backs. My advice then for new parents is that you should delay going back to work as long as you possibly can and get them into a routine that's good for them even if it's doesn't fit your lifestyle at the time. I don't envy young parents at all. I thought it was hard when I did it but it's much worse now.

Hi Debbie, how did it go last nite? did the phenegan do any good? Thanks for replying Clare, wend x

It seems to be about cues for us. A strict routine, tea at the table, followed by bath, pyjamas, story, songs and milk and into bed with music. The same music and if it needs the same story then the same story no matter how your heart sinks when you open the cover! I have also found baby massage a big help and I am a huge believer in letting them believe that the whole world goes to bed at the same time. Also burning lavender, roman chamomile and sandalwood essential oils at bedtime soothes. Spanish guitar music (obviously not the flamenco stuff!!) is nice and there are specialist tapes for relaxation out there. Ludvico Einaudi has a wonderful album out and the theme from twin peaks is also useful. Turn off all the noise in the house and put the emphasis on going to bed time. It may help if everyone whispers for the last half hour or so. STAYING UP IS BORING will be your mantra from now on. NOTHING HAPPENS AFTER BEDTIME is another! A lot of it is giving them signs to recognise so that they know what is coming and feel secure. Give it time and create a routine that you feel relaxed with too. You rub off on them. Don't try to solve all the problems at once. I would go for getting him into bed at the appropriate time. No sleeps in the day, lots of exercise before tea, then a full tummy, warm bath and strict routine should get that sorted out. Dawn's advice about gradually bringing forward the bedtime was really good. About him getting into your bed. Toddlers are more likely to squash or evict their parents in my experience! and since they grow up so fast who is ever going to say "Oh I wish he had given me one less cuddle in our bed"? The time will come soon enough when it is not cool to even walk with you never mind cuddle, kiss and hold hands! As for bottles, dummies, blankets and other comforters, I still have nightmares sometimes and like to cuddle up to my husband - so if he has something particular that is "strong" and "brave" to look after him in the night then why not. No one needs to find out about it until he gets a serious girlfriend and then she will probably be "strong" and "brave" enough to persuade him to abandon it in favour of her. People take all sorts of wierd things to University these days so get one instated to take over your night time duties!!! On a very serious note, your tiredness will be depressing your immune system amongst other things so if it is possible to get one good night's sleep per week, by perhaps asking grandparents to take over then do it. You must safeguard your health to be able to mother your child. You are very important. Good luck Keep posting Abigail

Hi Debbie, I know that feeling so well, my daughter was always an awkward sleeper but I used to find that if i played Stings the best of, she'd fall straight asleep. Someone told me that if you listened to a particular cd when you were pregnant the baby would recognize it and relax, which at 18months I tried and it worked for her (she is 8 years old now and still listens to it-she loves Sting!) anything is worth a try!!! My son however is 3 and a half and he falls asleep no problem (with the help of a light globe that changes colour!) but he wakes really early from 4:30 onwards and lies there shouting! nothing works for him! Try a favorite record or even Classic fm!!! Good luck Vikki

Thank you for all your messages again. I have tried cranial osteopathy for the colic he had(a whole story in its self and he still is windy but now thinks straining for a 'pop' is funny!!).It was expensive £35 i think and didnt have much effect.Shay is also a soya baby as were 2 of his 3 sisters.He went to the doctors yesterday and now has stuff for the bath to calm wot is they think excema. Has anyone else noticed that it seems to be BOYS that we are all talking about?!! lol typical huh. Anyway, he slept in my bed last night,partner on sofa but tonight its phenegan, his bed and if he wakes i will(fingers crossed) GETUP AND PUT HIM BACK....think of me please lol Debbi

Hi Wendy, Cranial osteopathy is a gentle head and other key points massage, any osteopath does it, but does cost, its becoming more popular so maybe availalble on NHS now. My son also has a few food intolerances which weve only just discovered and cutting those out has also helped, oranges, cocoa solids, lactose and artificial sweetners.

Hi Debbi, I don't have the solution either. Both of my children ended up in our bed till they were 5. I think where I went wrong was that they say you have to put them to bed awake. I used to feed them and let them snuggle and fall asleep before I put them to bed. They say all babies toddlers are restless and wake up. They must think "I was in her arms when I fell asleep and now I'm alone in my bed" - where would you rather be! My daughter has continued the trend she was always complaining about a sore arm because her little one had been sleeping on it all night! I think the other problem is the early weaning to the cup. I did this with my son too. I thought both he and I were very clever very advanced and wonderful because he was dry early too but have since thought I deprived him of the sucking thing that is very important to babies.

Hi Debbie, My little boy, Thomas is 3 yrs, has never slept more than 15 mins in any 24 hr period and would run round like a loony the rest of time, is on his 4th lot of sedatives which now make him sleep for an hour max and now when he's awake he is at least calmer!! I tried everything, to get him to sleep, screaming just aggrevated his reflux problem and his asthma, and made him vomit even more than his usual 6-7 times a day, he is milk intolerant too. Stephanie is now 11 months old and apart from not being a soya baby is exactly the same as her brother, so I have at least 12-14 sets of sicky bedding, p.j's, clothes etc to change each day and am very lucky if I get 20 mins sleep myself and thats usually about 6.30 a.m. They are both in my bed as it is the only way i can at least get some rest, even if its not sleep, although i am going to try and change that as soon as i get a day where i dont feel like the walking dead, any time i've tried in the past with thomas i've ended up "sleeping" on his floor next to the bed, not very comfortable i can tell you!! I wish you luck, and really hope you manage to sort it soon, I know what lack of sleep feels like, if you come across a miracle cure then PLEASE PLEASE let me know. CLARE, what is cranial watsit and who do i go to about it?? Wend xx

Have you heard of or tried 'Cranial Osteopathy', it was a miracle cure on my little boy. He hasnt had it for a while and this morning at 4am, was play time, so ive started swapping beds with him, he goes in with hubbie who sleeps through anything and i have his bed. Try the osteopathy just once and i would put money on it making a difference.

Mine dont have afternoon nap either....maybe when he starts nursery in Sept he will be worn out. Debbi Keep your thoughts and ideas coming...Im glad Im not in this boat alone.

I have no cures either but your not alone as quite a few of us have had many a sleepless night. We tried everything the HV told us to but nothing worked and the controlled crying we found too traumatic. With my son I used to have to lay with him while he went to sleep and then when he awoke I had to lay with him in his bed till he went to sleep as I didnt want him getting into the habbit of getting into our bed every night. He used to wake that often that I woke up in his bed many mornings then at 3 1/2 he started nursery school and started sleeping straight through, by this time I was pregnant again so I still wasnt getting much sleep but thankfully my daughter slept through from 2 months old. Just hold on to the thought that it wont last forever, at some point he will start to sleep through. Dawn x

Debbi I too don't have any miracle cures, but just wanted to add that I know just how you feel and have you my sympathy! Like Stacey said, don't pay too much attention to the health visitor's opinion (apologies to any HVs out there - nothing personal!). Mine was appalled that we let him come in our bed, but it was the only way to get some sleep and he grew out of it eventually. Unfortunately, my son didn't sleep properly until he started school. We did several things that helped a bit when you put them all together - he had warm milk in a bottle; when he came into our bed, one of us would go into his; he had a 'cuddly' blanket; we never left him to cry because then he'd get so worked up he wouldn't sleep at all!! He used to have a daytime nap (and no, he still didn't sleep even if we cut out the nap!) so I used to take a nap at the same time which helped a bit. All I can say is that there are plenty of us who know what you're going through, and feel for you, and that one day it really will get better :)))

they are great ideas only thing is he might be a little young to understand star charts and prizes maybe? I will try the phenagen tonight as I only tried it the once and the whole bottle just waved at me from the top of the kitchen cupboard. lol Debbi

ok try again have you tried leaving a nite light on, you probably have or a star chart so start off with 1 star for 1 nite let him choose his prize,or you can piece of fruit eg if he gets up take him back to his bed and remind him of the star, after a coup[le of night you can aim for 1 week bigger prize after a month maybe trip to macdonalds etc. then gradually make it longer for the prize. what do you think ? i will keep racking my brains sandra

thanks all for the advice. Just a little more info for you.He is my 4th and the only boy.All the girls went to bed at 7pm went to sleep.With him its 10pm, I have to go lie with him til he's asleep then half way through the night he wakes, climbs out of his bed and into mine. Phenegen made him hyper, he's allergic to milk, he still has a dummy and he has no medical problems!! Have tried the set routine and the going to bed earlier but to no avail.He wants mum only so not help from older children or partner. I can not leave him to cry as he wont stay in bed and if i close the dorr to keep him in his room he screams so bad his sisters feel sorry for him and let him out. He will sleep all night with me but poor partner sleeps on sofa as he is afraid he'll suffocate him!!He gave up his bottle easily at 9 months and has had a cup ever since.<He never went to bed with a bottle either so I darnt try that one> How on earth would I manage if I had another one??? What if they both want to sleep in my bed lol perish the thought.... ANY MORE IDEAS PLEASE!!!

don't want to upset you but my eldest now 26yrs was 4 1/2 years before she slept all night, her 1st is 3 months and started going through the nite, typical. but i did try phenergan with one of my others its a mild sedative used for teething similar to calpol . luckily 3 out the five were angels i do sympathise with you all. i had katie over night at 8 weeks and had to get up twice to feed her it nearly killed me, and all she kept doing was smiling at me and blowing milk bubbles. but believe there comes a time when you can't wake them those teenage years. and then the drunken fall in the door at 18 onwards so you still get woken. all i can say is i enjoyed my 5 and it went to quick, and it will for you so the good times and the bad come and go several times. a new grandma i can start again sandra

Does your son use a botttle or dummy? Did he use to? I got my son into a routine and it was hard, it took longer than the 2 weeks that my health vistor said it would. I did the whole put him to bed, let him cry then go back etc. This went on for weeks and weeks! Then it clicked, what are we told when we cant sleep? Have a warm milky drink! I started giving my son warm milk in a cup but still no sleep, he was complaining about it spilling every where. So then I gave him back his bottle, bearing in mind we had no problems taking it away. He now has a warm bottle of milk at 8 every night, takes himself off to bed and is asleep within 10 mins! It took 3 days and it has been the same for the past 3 years! He only ever has his bottle for sleep time and would never take it out the house, not that my health visitor agrees, but believe me I am a much happier parent for it. Hope that you have some luck x

Debbi you have my full sympathy, been there with all 4 of mine and when your going through it you think it'll never end, but I promise you it does! I tried everything from lying beside them to leaving them to cry, nothing worked, it just eventually happened . My 4 year old still doesn't fall asleep in his bed but usually on the couch, but at least he is sleeping through the night. There are quite a few web sites with tips if you put sleep problems into google, but if your anything like me you'll have tried them all. Anyway try and hold onto your sanity and good luck. It does get better!