General Chat

Not every speeding driver gets prosecuted though - heck - how many times have any of us been stopped by a policeman and given a warning about some law we've broken, but not prosecuted us for it? And here we are trying to legislate against biology and hormones?! In essence, I agree with everything you say, Grampa Jim, it's just that life is not as black and white as the law would like to make it.

Felicity, I understand your comment about "Points of Law", but still stand by what I said. You either obey the law, or you break the law. Having sex with someone under 16 is a breach of the law and not arguable. And, bearing in mind the earlier comment about Oranges and Apples, you are either driving within the speed limit, or you are not. There is no gray area. The Higher Court can decide whether a Conviction is flawed because of an error in procedure.

I'm sorry to disagree with you here, Grampa Jim, but there are grey areas in the law. That is why we have issues we refer to as 'loopholes', why laws are constantly changing and being made anew, and why we have a Supreme Court the job of which is to review lower court decisions and to interpret the law. And flexibility in sentencing.

We have to remember that there are no gray areas in Law. I don't know who this silly girl chose to father her child, or how old he was. I have noticed that there is a lot of Media reporting of young girls getting pregnant but have yet to see that the Male has been prosecuted for it. Perhaps a Court order for the father to provide (at least financially) for the child would be a step forward from the Named, Shamed and Failed CSA?

I think there are 2 separate issues here, several people have said that they fell pregnant and they made the best of the situation, and I have no doubt that they are wonderful parents. This young girl has been foolish and looks like she planned the sitaution, its alright the family being behind her, but what about the future, why wasn't she taught its best to be in a stable relationship before you bring a child into this world (there seems to be no mention of the Dad at the minute). Being a full time parent is one of the hardest jobs in the world and I dont think for one minute she has realised what it involves, I just hope they can provide the love and stabilty this baby will need,a nd that she now has the sense to realise if she wants to do well for the baby to study and try and get a decent education behind her, Sheila

Paul, your comment about child abuse is what makes this such a thorny subject. You were not, clearly, but some other man might have deserved the title.

Compassionate comment Lapland Lovely! Life must be easier for those of us who learn from the mistakes we make but many of us don't and that doesn't make us stupid - the poor girl's not gonna have a life of luxury and bliss even if she does live on benefits and gets a flat. If she's a single girl with very little experience of life and a baby her life is likely to be pretty shitty and hard for a long time to come.

Quite agree with you Grampa Jim, but let's be realisitic - you have to pick the battle in order to win the war. The age of consent law was enacted as a first attempt to protect young people - well, girls really, the idea that boys needed protection in this way hadn't yet formed - from predatory adult males, and not necessarily to get in the say of same age, consenting relationships. The law is used more frequently for dealing with what is now recognised as 'sex abuse'. And let's be honest, if everyone was hauled before the courts the moment any law was broken, wouldn't we all spend an inordinate amount of time in the courtroom? The young petty criminals of which you speak are another issue, and another discussion. I don't think we should compare apples and oranges here.

now THAT is an answer, thank you.

Paul, Yes it is. Anyone who has sex with an underage child is, by definition, a child molester and liable to be prosecuted for it. If people are not happy with this they should campaign to have the law changed. Having sex with a 15 year old cannot be disguised as "Civil Disobedience" it is a Crime.

thats not an answer

Paul, We can't pick and choose which Laws we are going to obey and which we are going to break. That way lies Anarchy.

we don't think that of everyone claire.once is a mistake twice is just stupidxxxxx(:

OK here we go then. I met my wife when she was 15, I was a little older (not excessively, but it was a few years). she turns 30 this year we're still together. If we'd had sex before she was 16 (and I'm not saying we did or didn't, just playing devils advocate), do you think I should be prosecuted for it then ? Would I have been a child abuser then as Lyda suggested earlier ?

I am like Jean,,,I too had a baby when i was barely 16 , I made a mistake and i paid for it, I was made to have my son adopted, But there is no way i was a tart, One only has to have sex once to hit the jackpot, Jean i know how you feel, It makes me angry that others think becasue you have a child in your teenage years and out of wedlock , that you have loose morals, Its called a MISTAKE...

Whatever the reason for selecting a particular age of consent I still say there is no point unless those who break the law suffer the consequences. The same applies to those young tearaways who happily rob your house, cock a snook at the Police and Courts and are back on the streets the next day. And why? Because the little dears are too young to be punished? If they are old enough to commit the crime they are old enough to do the time.

Felicity - the voice of reason as always

What a hornet's nest this is! Emotions run so high when moral issues are at stake. Jean, thank you for your perspective on this, you made such a lot of sense. Morals are often, though not always, artifical perameters. The age of consent is a man-made law, (there were no women in parliament at the time the English law was enacted) and it varies from country to country as we know. Here, the so-called gentry, at the turn of last century or so when the age of consent was raised to 16, argued for a lower age so that their sons would not be in trouble if they were caught out with young servant girls. Before then, there was no age of consent for boys and the age of consent has been as young as 12. In other countries, it is seen as a good thing if a young girl has a baby and can 'prove' her fertility. My only point here is that, unlike, say, killing, for the most part, sexual activity is a very fluid moral issue. Times change, cultures change, and much hardship and anguish can been caused by making judgements when not all the facts are known. Sex education, responsibility and accountability are all other subjects besides the original one raised which was was this young girl to be reviled or not.

Jean,didnt really want tar any correspondents with any brushes, maybe i am living too much in the past...........

Feel that I have to have my say too. Having brought up two kids myself, both grown up now, I feel that you can only advise them the best that you can. Whether they listen is up to them. From my own experience when they are at the teenage stage they think that they know it all! (same as I did). Her mum is right when she says that she can't make her do anything. I just hope that the girls family will be there to support her when she needs it. Maggy