Genealogy Chat

This carries on right through the 20th century, basically until the stigma disappears in recent years. In days gone by the courts could enforce a 'bastardy order' which forced a father to pay for maintenance; 10s6d (not as previously said 30 shillings!) a week in the 1930s. So a father would only agree to be named if he was ready to support the woman, and sometimes fathers who were named contested this hotly. This business of maintenance goes right back into history so parish records are also affected in earlier times. Also remember some girls found a man to marry them and take on the child; if the child was born shortly after the marriage the father may not genetically be the husband, but will be listed as such on the certificate. A very high proportion of 'legitimate' first children were concieved out of wedlock and the father was surprisingly often a different man.

Don't always believe the name of the father on a marriage cert if the child was illegitimate. I almost believed mine until I found out he had actually named his grandfather. Oh how they confuse us!!! He obviously did this to save face or maybe he even believed his grandfather was his father. Helen

Thanks Michael! What a good website.........I have saved it to my favourites! Wendy x

Try this website for information on certificates. http://home.clara.net/dixons/Certificates/bmdadvice.htm Regards,Michael

Thanks to everyone for their helpful contributions. I will let you know the outcome when the birth cert arrives. I ordered her marriage certificate at the same time, so hopefully that will give me some info. as well. Once again, thanks to you all! Wendy x

Hi All Ernest's marriage cert has arrived this morning and his father's name and occupation are clearly stated in the correct column. Wonder whether they just didn't mention the small issue of his illegitimacy to the vicar? Lou

My gggrandmother was base born 1846, and had her mother`s surname up until marriage. Luckily on her marriage certificate from 1866 her fathers name is given. If you do not have any luck with the birth certificate try and get a copy of the marriage certificate. Good luck, Elizabeth

According to the information I have, a full birth certificate should contain "Full name and occupation of the father if married to the mother (or if he attended with the mother and signed the registration entry)." Does this Help? Derek.

Woah, reading these replies, I can't wait to get my hands on Ernest's birth and marriage certs now. I'll be joining in with the mugging the postman brigade! Lou xx

My Gran (and all her siblings) were born out of wedlock, but my G Gran used her partners name, so on the certificates they all have their father's name. I have a GG grandmother called Mary Doutch Evans (born 1835) . Evans was her (widowed) mothers married name, Doutch was the surname of the lodger (and her father) !!! maggie

My illegitimate great-grandmother has in the Father's column of her marriage cert "illegitimate daughter of Susan Barnes". nell

my gt grandfather was born illagitamate, no sighn of his father on his birth certificate, or his baptisim record, he was fosterd out at the age of one, to a couple that had no children of their own, it was around nine year's later my gt grandfather took on the surname of the head, as his middle name. i still have no idea as to his real father, dont expext i ever will, just hope there is something hanging around in the parish chest, i live in hope!!!!! julie

My husbands gg grandmother called herself Eliza Blake, when I did locate a marriage for her it was under Eliza Churcher father James Blake, it is the right one. It turns out that was her mothers maiden name as mother and daughter were born out of wed lock (so grandmothers maiden name as well). One other I have found was in parish church records while looking for my family I have come across christenings for children born out of wed lock with both the mothers maiden name as well as the fathers full name (but only a few). Irene

Oh Well, Guess I will just have to keep hassling the postman every day!!! Once again, thanks everyone for your input...........every little helps!!! Wendy x

Oh shame Wendy!! You never know though! I hope it shows him for you.

My ggrandfather was illegitimate and was born Ernest Turner Kirkham. He later dropped the Kirkham and became Ernest Turner. Don't know YET whether his father is named on the cert but his parents married when he was 3 and were together till they died in their 70's! Lou

Thanks Edith, The second name is EDITH, so I don't think this would be the father's surname! Wendy x

If he isnt on there, check out the child's second name if he has one. Quite often I have found in parish registers the "base born" or "natural born" child would have a second name which is obviously a surname. One assumes this was a way of establishing that the father should be responsible in some way - perhaps paying some dosh to the poor mum.

Thanks Brenda, Just wondered, am waiting (with finger nails bitten to nothing!) for a birth certificate and couldn't bear the wondering any longer..............sorry!!! Wendy x

It is very, very unlikely that the father would be named. His name might appear on a baptism, but even that is unusual. B