Genealogy Chat

Oh, Sarah Paine - his sister!!! That's good, coz it really ties everything up!! Merry

I wondered where sister Sarah was in 1881, when Charles was living with his mum. Guess she was a servant somewhere....with these variable places of birth they keep giving, it would be hard to know which one she is. All the places of birth that have appeared above are quite close together and quite typical of the names of places people pick and choose from when they live in these parts of London!!! Merry

Oh My God you are sooooooo clever!!! Yes Charles Henry was batchelor when married to Annie Witnesses for marriage were Edward C Holl (who I know) and Sarah Paine. Thankyou very very much for all your time and effort - am so excited now!!! Katie x

Oh, don't need that answer now.......!! Back on the 1871 census, Charles has a sister named Sarah, after his mum, I should think. She was 5. I think this is her in 1891 and Charles (bootmaker again) is there too. (single!) 1891: French, Annie abt 1873 St Pancras, London, England Servant St Pancras London Matthews, Rose abt 1869 Bloomsbury, London, England Servant St Pancras London McKellar, Josiah Hebt abt 1847 Banbury, London, England Boarder St Pancras London Paine, Edwin J abt 1858 Rotherhithe, Surrey, England Head St Pancras London Paine, Geo Edwin abt 1885 St Pancras, London, England Son St Pancras London sister>>>>Paine, Sarah Elizah abt 1862 Whitechapel, London, England Wife St Pancras London Paine, Sidney Chas abt 1890 St Pancras, London, England Son St Pancras London >>>>Russell, Chas Henry abt 1869 Kilbury, London, England Brother-in-law St Pancras London Merry

Was Charles Henry a bachelor when he married Annie Holl? Merry

Oh Joy!!!! Ignore last message! 1881: Sarah Pamer abt 1845 Bath, Somerset, England Head 57 Market St, Paddington, London, England Charles Russell abt 1869 Paddington, Middlesex, England Son 57 Market St, Paddington, London, England Sarah is married, but hubby isn't there. I'm not at all sure what her name is supposed to be??? Pamer is a bit what it looks like, but sounds a bit unlikely! Merry

The trouble is, Sarah Russell probably re-married and it would be likely her young children would take her new husband's name. Equally likely they then reverted to their original name when they left home. Trouble is, how to find the correct marriage for someone named Sarah Russell!! (millions of them!) Merry

Back in 1851, George John/John George should be about 6 or 7 (from that death reg)......here he is with his parents: 1851: Elizabeth Russell abt 1824 Cornwall, England Wife Paddington Middlesex Emma Russell abt 1850 Paddington, Middlesex, England Daughter Paddington Middlesex John Russell abt 1815 Oxfordshire, England Head Paddington Middlesex >>>>>John Russell abt 1845 Paddington, Middlesex, England Son Paddington Middlesex Mary Am Russell abt 1847 Paddington, Middlesex, England Daughter Paddington Middlesex Merry

Forgot to say, Sarah (mum) aged 24 in 1871 is already a widow :o(( As her last child is aged one month and she is living with her late husband's family, I would assume John George/George John shouldn't have been dead more than about 10 months max. Like this one: Deaths Mar 1871 Russell George John 27 Whitechapel 1c 318 Names round the right way!! And they (mum and Charles) are living in Paddington which is less than five miles from Whitechapel. This might be the marriage reg (can't look for bride's name unfortunately) Russell John George Kensington 1a 271 - 1864 Q2 Merry

Hmmmmm....he is with his mum and paternal grandparents, but dad is out (update - see further down....he's not out, he's died) Alfred Russell abt 1856 Paddington, Middlesex, England Son Paddington London Alice Russell abt 1870 Mile End, Middlesex, England Grandchild Paddington London Arthur Russell abt 1867 Paddington, Middlesex, England Son Paddington London >>>>>Charles Russell abt 1869 Bethnal Green, Middlesex, England Grandchild Paddington London Eliza Russell abt 1866 Paddington, Middlesex, England Daughter Paddington London Elizabeth Russell abt 1823 Swell, Cornwall, England Wife Paddington London Henry Russell abt 1859 Paddington, Middlesex, England Son Paddington London John Russell abt 1819 Stantanhacket, Oxfordshire, England Head Paddington London Richard Russell abt 1861 Paddington, Middlesex, England Son Paddington London mum>>>>Sarah Russell abt 1844 Bath Daughter-in-law Paddington London Sarah Russell abt 1866 Mile End, Middlesex, England Grandchild Paddington London Walter Russell abt 1863 Paddington, Middlesex, England Son Paddington London William Russell abt 1851 Paddington, Middlesex, England Son Paddington London Merry

This is probably the birth reg for the above IGI bap: 1868 Q4 Bethnal Green 1c 305. Russell, Charles Henry Going to see if I can find them on the census....... Merry

This is possible: CHARLES HENRY RUSSELL Birth: 02 SEP 1868 Christening: 10 OCT 1869 All Saints, Stepney, London, England Parents: Father: JOHN GEORGE RUSSELL Mother: SARAH ANN Messages: Extracted birth or christening record for the locality listed in the record. Dad's names are round the wrong way, but worth investigating! Merry

So (for ref) this is Charles in 1901: Phoebe Holl abt 1872 London, England Sister Kensington London Annie L Russell abt 1879 London, England Wife Kensington London Charles F Russell abt 1900 London, England Son Kensington London Charles Henry Russell abt 1869 London, England Head Kensington London Charles a bootmaker. I'm wondering if perhaps he didn't always have a middle name, or at least maybe it's not on his birth reg, as the birth reg you have may belong to the other Charles who's dad is William (further up the post) Off to do some more looking................ Merry

Hi Janet, What were the witnesses names on the marriage certificate?

Charles father definately George John Russell on marriage cert?

Looks like that Charles' father is William. 1861. ............>Ann C Russell abt 1854 Islington, Middlesex, England Daughter St Pancras Middlesex ............>Caroline Russell abt 1828 Clerkenwell, Middlesex, England Wife St Pancras Middlesex Mary J Russell abt 1860 Kensington, Middlesex, England Daughter St Pancras Middlesex Roseanna Russell abt 1856 Hackney, Middlesex, England Daughter St Pancras Middlesex ........................>William W Russell abt 1827 Isle of Wight, Whitewell Head St Pancras Middlesex William W Russell abt 1858 Kensington, Middlesex, England Son St Pancras Middlesex

could quite be - don't know how i've missed that !!! Will investigate that family further to check - thankyou very much for your help katie x

Katie Could this be him in 1871? Note older brother called George. Ann C Russell abt 1853 Islington, Middlesex, England Daughter Camberwell Surrey Caroline Russell abt 1828 Clerkenwell, Middlesex, England Wife Camberwell Surrey ***Charles Hy Russell abt 1869 Shoreditch, Middlesex, England Son Camberwell Surrey Frank Russell abt 1866 Shoreditch, Middlesex, England Son Camberwell Surrey George H Russell abt 1864 Shoreditch, Middlesex, England Son Camberwell Surrey Mary Jane Russell abt 1860 Notting Hill, Middlesex, England Daughter Camberwell Surrey Lynne

Katie Where have you looked? Lynne

Have received today marriage cert 25/12/1898 for Charles Henry Russell (29) and Annie Louisa Holl, Charles father is names as George John Russell (Deceased). Charles was born (have refernece for Charles Henry Russell Shoreditch 1869), on his marriage he lived at 127 Portobello Road, Kensington, London. I have found Charles and Annie on the 1901 census but cannot locate him or more importantly George John Russell on any previous census. This is all the information that I have, wondered if anybody fancied a 'mission' Thankyou in advance Katie x