Genealogy Chat

I was looking at the 1871 census tonight for a workhouse in crumpsall, Manchester and I it upset me to read in the conditions section various people being labelled as 'imbecile' or 'idiot' how awful this must have been. has anyone else come accross this? what did it actually mean? thanks catherine

It wasn't , it was just different terminology as to that used today. Not nice to be called a bastard either but that is exactly what is in some parish registers ,

I looked up my g/g grandfathers witnesses names and they were both in the workhouse, one with a twelve year old son, and ironically, my Son has just had three major back operations and his first appointment was at the hospital that used to be the workhouse that my Grandfathers witnesses were in-sad-so very, very sad. I think if you had no education and no money you were just labelled.

An imbecile is a person with a mental age of between 3 and 7 years. Today we only think of it as a term of abuse really, but it has a medical meaning. Merry

Hi It is awful isnt it. On the 1851 a brother of my 3xGF is labeled on the census as 'idiot' I have no idea why, I guess he could have had any number of the disabilities we know to day which could casue learning difficulties. But at that time they just labeled everyone as an idiot or imbecile. Jacqui Jacqui

On the 1901 my g g grandparents have got the wife's mother living with them and she's down as being an 'imbecile' today we would probably diagnose her with alzheimers or demetia - it's just the way things were...

There was a thread on one of the boards the other day which listed all of these terms and gave the meaning of them all. Perhaps someone else can remember whose thread it was. They were all just medical terms in those days and not meant as a term of abuse. Here's three I found:- Lunatic ~ a mentally ill person with periods of lucidity. Imbecile ~ persons who have fallen in later life into a state of chronic dementia. Idiot ~ persons who suffer from congenital mental deficiency Kath. x

yeah I agree awful.makes me think how lucky I am having 2 beautiful children and a wonderful hubbie.But this is what happened however awful. Just wrong choice of names I think. although people were not as educated as they are today.

Also found this on Gendocs (it's how the census enumerators were told to define the words): Lunatic ~ a mentally ill person with periods of lucidity. Imbecile ~ persons who have fallen in later life into a state of chronic dementia. Idiot ~ persons who suffer from congenital mental deficiency. Merry

'imbecile' A stupid or silly person; a dolt. A person whose mental acumen is well below par. A person of moderate to severe mental retardation having a mental age of from three to seven years and generally being capable of some degree of communication and performance of simple tasks under supervision. The term belongs to a classification system no longer in use and is now considered offensive. 'idiot' In medicine and psychology, an idiot is a person with a very severe mental retardation or a very low IQ level. Idiots were defined as people whose IQ were below 20 (with a standard deviation of 16). In the current classification, these people are now said to have profound mental retardation. The word is no longer used as a scientific term.

I have just posted a very long and extremely informative reply to this thread, which promptly vanished into space, so you will never know! (I was born in Crumpsall Workhouse, after it became a hospital) Olde Crone

thanks merry what more ca I say to that

I have just posted a very long and extremely informative reply to this thread, which promptly vanished into space, so you will never know! (I was born in Crumpsall Workhouse, after it became a hospital) Olde Crone

You're repeating yourself Olde Crone, LOL Kath. x

oh old crone please tel me what that was I would be very interested.

Little Sir Echo, hello, hellooo....! If this Site doesnt stop throwing me off every time I try to post, then I shall throw the Site AND the computer out the window! I will try this quickly - my rellie in Crumpsall Workhouse, imbecile. Turned out age 40 she was deaf and dumb. Olde Crone

People call me an idiot today...in 2006! I get called all sorts of things (does human nature really change that quickly?) Suzanne

Hi This thread is of Interest to me my son was born in Crumpsall Hospital. Didn't know it was a work house before. I have rellies from the area so might have a look at the work house records. Sue

oh suzanne your not an idiot, but I know what you mean the word has so stuck hasn't it. even now it is used so much.