Genealogy Chat

That's very interesting Patricia.....and maybe to some extent people were ''brainwashed'' by doctors and by convention to behave and even feel in a particular way........... My grandparents first child was a stillborn son. They never had another boy and when my mum (their dau) was a young adult she used to tease her father, saying, ''You never had a son, but you had the next best thing'' (this because she was good at ''boyish'' tasks such as woodwork etc etc)........ I have heard this story hundreds of times and recently said to mum didn't she think her remark about ''you never had a son'' was decidedly cruel considering the circumstances......?? She was incredulous and said ''how ridiculous''.....but when I said.......what if it had been me having a stillbirth in the last few years.....would you have made such a remark to me?? She said, ''of course not.....things are quite different now''..................... There have been a lot of changes in the last 80 years............. Merry

My mother-in-law had a baby in the same year as your half sister was born - 1946. This baby also lived 12 hours and on the death certificate the cause of death was given as Prematurity - 7 month baby, so the doctor had given us a little extra information. We had been aware that my mother-in-law had lost a baby at some point, but until we got the certificates we did not know that the baby was premature and that he was born almost exactly one year before my husband and also had the same name as my husband. It made him feel a bit strange when we found out. Kath. x

When I had my 1st baby in 1968, caesarian was only a last resort! and wasn't done lightly. My best friend had one the same year and she lost her baby. It was in the local paper. So! if that is what it was like in the 60s....what ever must it have been like in the 40s? If I were you Merry, I'd have a little go at the Hospital if you know which one. Anythings worth a try?

Merry I don't suppose you will be able to find out more. Possibly the mother's blood pressure problems led to the need for a caesarian before the baby was due to be born, or caused labour to start prematurely. Generally prem babies would have died because their lungs weren't developed enough for them to breathe on their own, their underdeveloped livers would have given them jaundice and they wouldn't be able to keep warm and fight off potential infections etc. Olde Crone How sad! My husband's mother had a first baby in 1950. She ought to have had a caesarian but her obstetrician was on holiday when she went into labour and she had an incompetent chap who believed in letting things happen naturally. Eventually they did an emergency caesarian and my poor m-i-l nearly died. Her husband was given the news that the baby was dead and she had a 50% chance of recovery and he walked straight out of the hospital in shock and right in front of a bus, which fortunately stopped! When she had my husband 5 years later, they gave her a general anaesthetic and she stopped breathing and needed heart massage. 5 years after that she had her final baby. She told me that she was told the first baby was born dead, though she thought he wasn't. Her husband never spoke about it, though I realised how awful it must have been when I saw the look of relief on his face when I had my first child safely. Now they are both dead, I found that the baby had lived 2 minutes and my father in law had had to register the birth and death while his wife was still ill in hospital. The attitude then was to 'forget' about it and move on. When my husband's brother and his wife had a premature baby stillborn 12 years ago, they were encouraged to name him and take photographs and mourn. Times change. nell

Hi Merry so very sad :-((( Dont forget though that back in 1940ish I dont think they had maternity care as we do now. In my baby making days all we got was a listen to the heart beat through a cold metal trumpet! and that was only if your were lucky and nurse had a few spare mins. .... No scans and things back then! lol (1960/70s) I dread to think what it must have been like for our rellies way back.....poor women :-( No contraception! NO panty liners and the like! only the cut off tails of the old mans shirts lol .. yuk! and NO ARIEL washing powder! double yuk! lol Go open a nice bottle of what ya fancy Merry and cheer up! :-)) Gerri x.

Olde Crone....that is so very sad........thank you for telling your story. Merry

Hi Merry I had full blown eclampsia in my first pregnancy, possibly due to the fact that I did not bother with ante natal care, being of the opinion that I was a fine strapping healthy young woman. I went into labour, having felt very odd for a few days, and went into hospital. They were absolutely horrified, my BP was off the scale and it was too late to do a caesarian. I had a fit during delivery and I dont remember anything else for about 48 hours. The baby (full term) survived luckily and is now herself a strapping great girl! I was very closely monitored through subsequent pregnancies and generally spent the last six weeks or so in hospital, but was only ever mildly pre-eclamptic. I was told that eclampsia, and pre eclampsia are more likely to occur in first pregnancies - they dont know why. I also had a brother who was stillborn. My mother had been told her baby was dead and went into hospital for four weeks to await the birth. He was never spoken of again and it was only recently that I discovered that his birth - date was the same as that of my daughter (but years apart of course). I think in those days it was considered to be 'best' for the thing to be swept under the carpet. I too had a stillborn baby and my husband was told by the Doctor 'not to let me wallow in it'. Thank goodness attitudes have changed. Olde Crone

Thanks Tina......I don't think she actually had pre-eclampsia (though, obviously I can't prove that!!). I had it, and my mum-in-law had the full blown eclampsia and nearly died...... But dad's first wife always suffered from high bloodpressure. She was told not to have children at all. Ended up (I believe) with this little girl and also a stillborn son (don't know when that was). Eventually she died of high BP problems, not associated with pregnancy, aged only 37 :o(( She looks lovely in her photos....it's sooo sad :o(( Merry (not!)

Hi Merry Something like this is always so sad, especially when the family have shut down on it. It feels like the child was being denied, but was probably just to spare the feelings of your father. I googled pre-eclampsia and got this: Pre-eclampsia is the most common of the serious complications of pregnancy. It is caused by a defect in the placenta, which joins mother and baby and supplies the baby with nutrients and oxygen from the mother's blood. Pre-eclampsia is symptom-less in the early stages and is detectable only by regular antenatal checks on the mother's blood pressure and urine. In its widest forms, pre-eclampsia affects about one in 10 pregnancies overall and one in 50 pregnancies severely. Pre-eclampsia can be very serious and is still responsible for the deaths of between three and five women a year as well as between 500 and 600 babies. It is potentially life-threatening to mother and baby if allowed to develop and progress undetected. Pre-eclampsia is curable only by delivery, which puts some babies at risk of death from prematurity. Pre-eclampsia cannot be predicted, reliably prevented or treated to allow the pregnancy to continue. Although first identified more than 150 years ago, its prime cause remains unknown. *** As to the length of the pregnancy - well, probably at least 30 weeks for the child to have survived at all, although the condition can develop as early as 24 weeks. Having said that, my mother, born 1916, was 8 weeks premature, weighted just over 2 lb and survived - or I would not be here writing this! Tina

Oh dear! I hadn't thought of that either, lol. Heather

Annie.....yes, that's what I thought...... Merry

It always seems to be that some families are completely straightforward and some.......well, aren't! Glen, I do hope you eventually get as much as you can sorted out about your family.....I have seen some of your other postings on the subject......................... Good Luck Merry

Not tight enough dates, unfortunately Heather (unless the babe wasn't his LOL LOL now I hadn't thought of that!!).......he went out there about 3 months before the birth and came back......well....I can't really tell properly?? Merry

I know how you feel Merry,i have spent three days trawling for marriages and births for my birth family,and found eleven possible births for the four couples,ALL of them have amendments.Maybe not all adoptions but eleven certs is beyond the funds at the moment,and the family just don't seem 'right'. Granny and Gramos seemed to lose more children at a few months than they kept,the ones they kept just seem to have strange things happen to the children they had. And yes i was VERY lucky. Glen

These stories are always so sad. I would have thought in those days the pregnancy would have had to be close to 28 weeks.

Glen, you were lucky....!! I just keep thinking about this poor little girl. My dad never told my mum about her ......or anything about his first marriage. I wonder if he decided to wipe the whole business from his mind?? Dad was a very methodical person who always kept every legal bit of paper to do with him and his family.....but thought he had his 1st wife's BMD certs he kept nothing for this baby............. Oh.......I must snap out of this!!! Merry

Do you know when your dad went to Burma or had leave or whatever? It might give you some idea .... Heather

Hi Merry,who can tell how long the pregnancy went on for. Admittedly i had the benefit of 1960's medicine,but i was 8/9 weeks early,weighing 2lbs 2oz,caught german measles on the second day and lived in an incubator for 7 weeks. There are so many variables in the equation you probably can't get close to an answer on this one.When i think how it could so easily have gone the other way for me i often wonder how the heck i did survive. Glen

Today I got the certs for the half-sister I never knew I had. She died aged 12 hours in Nov 1946. The cause was 1) Prematurity 2) Caesarian Section for maternal severe hypertension (the condition that killed babe's mother a few years later).............I now think this was the pregnancy that was ''hushed up'' by some family members because they knew dad's first wife had been told she couldn't have this baby (because it would kill her) and family thought (wrongly) she had gone through with an illegal abortion. I don't suppose I can find out any more, can I?? I wonder what the duration of the pregnancy would have been for the baby to have lived 12 hours? Babe's father (my dad) was in Burma at the time, so he never even saw the poor little mite :o(( ......(sorry to ramble on.......!) - Merry xx