Genealogy Chat

Hi Liz I thought exactly the same when I found out about 192.com. I know that you can look addresses and telephone numbers up on the BT website, but you have the option to go 'x-directory' and it doesn't list all the adults in the household. Jeannie

I didn't realise until today that the electoral roll was online for 2007 and it's only a few days since I found out that 2000-06 was. I don't know what information is available as I'm not going to pay for the credits to view it, but a search on my surname and town brought my family up and this worries me. The thing that gets me is this, we can't view the census past 1901 because some people may still be alive. How can selling access to the electoral register come under a different law, surely this contravenes the Data Protection Act? When you fill in the Electoral Roll does it say on the form that the information will be sold off and be available online to any Tom, Dick or Harry who pays to access it? I'm very unhappy about this and I wonder how many people actually know that their information is available like this. At a time when the government are all stressing the new ID cards to combat ID theft etc, how exactly does this fit into it? Does anyone know of an address I can write to to complain about my information being used this way?

Hi Liz I seem to think that when the registration papers come through you have a choice of being 'public' or not - you have to tick a box. At our last house I asked to be 'non public' and then realised they had put us on the full published register, I lodged a complaint which came to nothing...and to this day we show up as supposedly living there with the people who actually bought the house from us???? Found this................ Two versions of the register The full register has the names and addresses of everyone registered to vote and is updated every month. Anyone can look at it by visiting their local council offices, but copies can only be supplied for certain purposes, such as elections and law enforcement. Credit reference agencies are also allowed to use the full register, but only to check your name and address if you are applying for credit, and to help stop 'money laundering'. Anyone who has a copy of the register will be committing a criminal offence if they unlawfully pass on information from it. You do not have a choice about your name and address being on this register. The edited register will be available for general sale and can be used for any purpose. You can choose not to be on it. It will be kept separate from the full register and updated every month. The edited register can be bought by any person, company or organisation and could be used for different purposes such as checking your identity and commercial activities such as marketing. The choice you have to make If you do tick the box on the voter registration form, your name and address will only appear on the full register, which will only be used for certain lawful purposes, such as elections, law enforcement and checking applications for credit. If you do not tick the box on the voter registration form, your name will also appear on the edited version of the register, which anyone can buy. This means anyone can use your details for any purpose. The person who fills in and signs the registration form must ask each person named on the form if they want their details to be included on the edited register and so available for anyone to buy. So, you must tick the box if you do not want your details to appear on the edited register which anyone can buy. Do not tick the box if you want your name and address to be included on the edited register and available to anyone who wants a copy of it. Gail.

The electoral roll should be available at your local post office and your library so you can see the information without using any credits. It only shows your age as you approach 18 so people can tell exactly in which election you can vote. People are so carried away with the Data Protection Act - recently I saw a very heated discussion of credit card 'confidentiality'. The 'keep everything secret' mob looked very silly after saying they used cheques and the 'other side' pointing out what information is on a cheque. Bring back the dinosaurs I say! Clive

My parents filled the form in and I have no idea if they even saw the box never mind ticked it >.< I can ask them but they won't remember. Surely it would be fairer if you were ticking the box to go public (opting in rather than opting out??) We are ex-directory for a good reason and also recently joined the TPS because we were getting 2-3 calls a day for my dad about home insurance *rolls eyes*. We take good precautions to ensure that we destroy bills and bank statements properly and it seems like we're wasting our time if the info is available online. I guess we'll have to wait until next year and make sure we tick that box...and then follow it up if they don't remove us. It's one thing having the info available at the town hall, but when someone can make money from it, that's really unfair (mind you if you say that to them the next thing you know people will be searching it for free). I guess it's the double standard that gets me...we can have this info but not the census from over 90 years ago?! You didn't need to worry about the Dinosaurs getting credit in your name, that's for sure :P

If it contravened the Data Protection Act, these Companies wouldn't be able to publish such data and would have been closed down long ago. As it is, the edited versions of the register are for sale to anyone for any purpose. By law, your local electoral registration office has to make the electoral register available for anyone to look at. As has been said, you can always 'opt out' of the edited version although if someone visited their local council offices they would be able to see your details on the full version anyway, if they were that desperate to get the info. Sam x

My (fairly recent) experience is that when you attempt to look at the FULL version, you are only allowed to look at the page which contains your own details (unless you are from an authorised agency). You can opt-out at any time, although of course your details won't be removed until they update the registers. My local authority updates immediately, so I believe. You can choose whether or not you want to be on the Electoral Roll at all - you do not have to vote if you don't want to. But you cannot opt out of filling in a census form and the information is collected under duress - that is why it remains private for 100 years. Personally, I don't think it matters much - you can only see the names of adults who have put forward their names, not a whole family. I have puzzled over old Electoral Registers long enough to realise they are not all that helpful! OC

OC, But don't you get fined for not filling in an electoral register card each year? Liz, The census contains what is described as 'sensitive personal data' and part of this is: (a) the racial or ethnic origin of the data subject, (e) his physical or mental health or condition, So other than the fact that people at the time of completing a census form were promised that no data would be published for 100 years, surely publishing the census earlier would contravene the act on the above 2 points. Sam x

There is this huge misconception that the Data Protection Act is all about confidentiality. This could not be further from the truth. If it were then the use and distribution of mailing lists would be illegal. The DPA is concerned with the 'Fair' use of personal data, which means that provided your data is used for reasonable and legal purposes there is no contravention of the law. There is also another important part of the DPA, that of consent. If a person consents that their data can be used in a particular way, then the provisions of the DPA don't even apply. This is the case with the electoral roll. On the subject of Cheques - think about the information they have. Bank Name Account Number Your Name Copy of Your signature Address (that you have cleverly written on the back) Need I say more?

And use of the electoral role is not new. Twenty five years ago I was paying people to address sales envelopes from the electoral roll. The only change is that Joe Public now knows it is available.. Clive

No, you are not fined for not filling in an Electoral form. Voting is a PRIVILEGE, not a duty (well, as far as the law goes, that is). If you choose not to use that privilege, then the only person affected is you. When Margaret Thatcher brought in the Poll Tax, something like three million people removed themselves from the Electoral Register - a bit stupid, I thought, as how could they ever hope to get rid of her if they couldn't vote! ............................. My father flatly refused to write his address on the back of a cheque - caused him no end of bother. OC

That's interesting - I'm sure my form says something about a fine for not filling it in. I never vote (no lectures please) and am not on the edited versions so can't see the point in sending a form back. I won't bother this year and see what happens! As for addresses on the back of cheques, I used to work for NatWest and whenever me and my friend went shopping and were asked for our address on the back of a cheque, we used to use the NatWest Branch address. Nobody ever asked for proof and never noticed that it was the same address as was printed on the front! Sam x

I didn't know that the census was forced, thanks for that, it does make the difference, as does what you're told at the time that you filled it in, I guess.

Sam I can't remember exactly, but I think it says something like You MUST complete this form if you wish to be included in the current Electoral Register. Failure to fill in this form may mean that you cannot vote. Are you mixing this up with the Council Tax form? That DOES have to be filled in. And failing to fill in a census form attracts a fine of £1000. OC

Well I never! On what grounds is it an offence, I wonder??? We do not have mandatory voting in this country, so why is it an offence not to fill in a form requesting the right to vote? Anyone know? OC

I think councils are still subsidised by central government by a formula which uses the number of people on the electoral roll. Local councils therefore have an incentive to ensure every adult is on the roll. Clive

Has anyone ever heard of anyone being fined for not filling in the form??? OC

According to the Electoral Roll Commission, registration is effectively compulsory as it is an offence not to be registered, but like OC I have never heard of any one actually being fined and there have been many debates over the years as to the value of enforcing the £1000 fine. A member of our family was stalked for 7 years and this is why the electoral roll issue became relevant to us - we were told to petition our local MP and join the campaign to have vulnerable people listed anonymously - I have just picked up the local free paper today and seen this:- 'Victims of Stalking and Domestic Violence will be able to keep their names off the Electoral Roll - the measures apply from Friday.' Obviously you would have to prove you needed to be listed anonymously, but from our experience (and it was a 7 year terrifying nightmare for the person involved) this can only be a move in the right direction. Gail.

That's a good point about it being compulsory to put your information on the form you get for voting about who lives as the address etc. My flatmates didn't fill it in last year - such things as poll cards, TV licences etc etc do not worry them - and I did, but yet everyone got a polling card in May. Perhaps it's taken from a different register.