Genealogy Chat

It feels like it. One (important) branch of my tree contains some Jones's. Ordinary, common or garden variety with extremely common christian names (Thomas, John, George...) I've applied already for five birth certificates for my great grandfather Thomas Jones born 1881 Bethnal Green and still can't find the right one. My question is, what do you do if your family name is so common? I'll be bankrupt at this rate at £7 a certificate...

Do you have him on the census with his parents? You could specify their names when you sent for a cert - you lose £3 and get £4 returned. Better than £7 though! Have you not found his marriage? How did you get back to his birth? Perhaps if you put some details on here we could narrow down the options. Please give every detail you know about.

OK. Thomas Henry Jones born 1881 Bethnal Green. (Born between 1st April 1881- 29 Oct 1881 ). From his marriage cert, his father was George Jones shipping Clerk. Found them on the 1841 census: Thos (50) Labourer born Ireland Mary (35) born NK John (14) born NK George (5) born NK living at 90 Commercial Road, Mile End Old Town. In 1891 George (his father) was living with his wife Martha, and sons George (17) a Newspaper Seller and Thomas (9) a scholar, at 27a Shepherd Street Buildings, Shepherd Street, Spitalfields Thomas married Ellen Rondeau in 1913 Marriages Mar 1913 Jones Thomas H Rondeau Bethnal G. 1c 310 He died 29 Oct 1932. I have his marriage and death cert, but can't find his birth anywhere. Help! Oh, then there's also the problem of his sisters..... I know his brother George died in WW1 in 1916.

So I take it you have tried all these and they are all wrong? Births Dec 1880 (>99%) Jones Thomas Henry Bethnal Green 1c 266 Scan available - click to view Jones Thomas Henry Westminster 1a 485 Scan available - click to view Jones Thomas Henry Holborn 1b 663 Scan available - click to view Births Jun 1881 (>99%) JONES Thomas Henry Bethnal Green 1c 262 I suppose there is a possibility that the second name didnt appear on his birth cert? Births Dec 1881 (>99%) JONES Thomas Bethnal Green 1c 303 I think if you have already spent all that money on duff certs then its a case of specifying the father and mothers names on the next one you choose. Take it you are absolutely sure of the year of birth.

I also tried just a Thomas born London City. I've narrowed the date of birth by the wedding cert and the death cert. I never knew you could specify a mother and father's name on a cert request. Can I do that through the usual web site, or do I have to approach the local registration district? It really annoys me that you can't go and browse the certificates.

You can ask for pointers on the GRO online site - yes! I do feel for you, such a common name - you could look at them but that would be a trip to London and that would probably cost more than all the wrong certs.

I live and work in London so it wouldn't cost me anything to get there, but I thought you couldn't actually browse the sertificates, only the register and I can do that online. Can you look at actual certificate entries then? :hopeful:

No Lesley I was thinking of looking at the actual registers. Im sure someone will come along and tell us if/where you can do that.

Lesley/Suzanne It is only the indices you can view online or elsewhere....The full certificate details can only be obtained by the purchase of a certificate. As previously said the use of the GRO checking facility may be the best way, cost wise, for you to order further certificates. Alternatively as you are, like me, chasing common surnames in the London area it may be worth waiting for the completion of the relevant part of the DOVE project. Chris

DOVE?

DOVE Digitisation of Vital Events... http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/aboutus/lookingahead/Digitisation_of_Vital_Events.asp#0 Chris

Sorry...I should have said. For births the DOVE project will be useful if you have a mother's maiden name. Chris

OK, Googled. Looks like a huge project. When you order a certificate, how do they look it up to print it? Microfiche?

I was lucky enough to be forewarned by my grandmother that her mother's birth had never been registered (birth 1886, legal requirement to register, siblings all registered!) These days the hospitals send the registrar the details, so if you forget, you get a reminder (esp if, like us, you couldn't make your mind up on a name before taking the child home). Might be worth checking out whether parish registers would supply any deficiency? If the parents are from Ireland, you might have to locate the nearest Catholic church records?

We had a hell of a job finding my grandad.Had his marriage cert with dads name on.We could not still find grandads birth.He came from Bethnal Green.We knew he had,had a brother and the name of him that had died.Traced him and found grandad was in his mothers maiden name as she had not married great grandad.Still dont know if grandad was the real son or not. Annie

Is it possible that his birth is registered in Mile End Old Town? The family seem to have been living there in 1881, and ancestry notes that the appropriate registration district for that address would be Mile End Old Town. (I assume they are this family, apologies if not: Class: RG11; Piece: 482; Folio: 131; Page: 33; Line: ; GSU roll: 1341106. Name: George Jones Age: 40 Estimated birth year: abt 1841 Relation: Head Spouse's name: Martha Gender: Male Where born: Bishopsgate, Middlesex, England Civil parish: Mile End Old Town County/Island: London Country: England Street address: 24 Shandy St Condition as to marriage: Married Occupation: Commission Agent (Shipping) Registration district: Mile End Old Town Sub-registration district: Mile End Old Town, Eastern ED, institution, or vessel: 21 Household Members: Name Age Eleanor Jones 10 Elizabeth Jones 3 George Jones 40 George Jones 7 Martha Jones 35

I suppose this might be possible? Name: Thomas Jones Year of Registration: 1881 Quarter of Registration: Apr-May-Jun DISTRICT: Mile End Old Town County: London, Middlesex Volume: 1c Page: 544 (click to see others on page)

The third quarter of 1881 hasn't been transcribed on FreeBMD as yet. Looking at the image for that quarter on Ancestry, there are these possibles: Births, Sep 1881 Jones, Thomas, Mile End, 1c 539 Jones, Thomas, Bethnal Green, 1c 186 Or, if his age was slightly out on the mc this one is a possible (but in which case he should be on the 1881 census): Name: Thomas Henry Jones Year of Registration: 1880 Quarter of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec DISTRICT: Bethnal Green County: Greater London, London, Middlesex Volume: 1c Page: 266

Ivy, I think you might have something there! I never thought of Mile End Old Town.... That is the right family you found. I feel my debit card twitching again....LOL

Richard: I already have this one in my extensive collection! ... ;-) 1c 266