Genealogy Chat

That's good!

Glad you had a successful day.

Sue
x

Well I'm back and have proof he was not born in Richmond. He was from Little Marlow in Buckinhamshire. Now I have to find the parish records and see if' he's on there. The visit to the centre was very informative as they had original docs about the dairy and farm the family had early 1800 - 1902.
Found some of their homes and the church too.
Felt really weird walking in their shoes so to speak.

Di

Carol - Thank you
I saw this one yesterday when I was looking through IGI yet again!! It could be a match as one of Richard b1767 son's gave his birthpalce as being Marlow Bucks, but on census another gave it as Weshop Berks. I have got lines to follow thanks to people on here.
Di
Sorry, forgot to say thanks re -M4

Richard Stanford b1745 but christened
20/12/1765 in Olney Bucks

Could this be your Richard`s father

Before the M4 I seem to remember using the A4
I know this went to Maidenhead and Reading then on to London.

You also need to realise that not everyone was baptised in the same place as they were born.

Births may have been in the mother's old home......especially for first births when new mothers went home to their mums for support. Births can also happen unexpectedly when visiting relations.

Baptisms used to be done (in most cases) fairly soon after birth but I've seen examples when several children in one family were all baptised at the same time and the oldest was perhaps 6 or 7 years old. Sometimes if the family were living away from their home village for a while they would wait until they got back before having the children baptised.

In one family on my tree the children were all baptised just after their father died. I get the feeling he might have been non-conformist and hadn't approved but mother had the whole family done as soon as he was no longer around.

Places of birth in censuses can sometimes be wrong simply because people forgot........it must have been difficult with large families to remember who was born where and when. They were often illiterate and people didn't make the fuss about birthdays and dates of birth which we do now. Sometimes if their mother had died perhaps a person would assume that their own place of birth was where the family had lived when they were all children.

There are lots of possible reasons why a place of birth can differ from one census to another or be wrong. A missing baptism may not even be in the county you are expecting let alone the parish you thought it was.

People's ages on censuses can be several years out if they themselves are uncertain about how old they are and they have no way of checking their date of birth as we do.

Good luck
Sue

Thanks for all the suggestions.
Di

As a last resort or possible first resort ask if they have the Bishop's Transcripts, sometimes details are on there when even the PR's haven't

Good Luck

I wonder!!!
William Richard appears to be the names for all my paternal grandparents etc going back to the one in 1792. I have now found William b1767 in Wandsworth Surrey and maybe he could be william Richard known as Richard? Is it just wishful thinking on my part?
Di

I've just found a Richard Stanford b1745 but christened
20/12/1765 in Olney Bucks who married later that year. I'm assuming he was christened just before he married. I don't think he's my rellie though. I'm just making the point that birth/christening dates can be so far apart.

I'm looking for a Richard b about 1767. I've been through the whole IGI again today!!!
On another thought, what road was before the M4 across west to east Berkshire/London please?

Thanks
Di

My great grandmother was born in Falmouth in Cornwall. Her parents came from Somerset though, and they waited several years before having 3 children baptised in the little local church of the Somerset village where her father came from.
She was actually 6 when she was baptised!

Babies were quite often not baptised in the same place that they were born. I wasn't myself.........any future researcher would have difficulty finding my baptism because it was in a village where my parents were renting a house for a short while.

The logical thing to do is to go outwards from the birthplace in increasing circles but if that doesn't work for parishes fairly close try thinking laterally.

Look in villages where earlier generations may have been perhaps.

Maybe the missing ancestor will turn out to have been baptised a long way from where you expect or perhaps in a different denomination. Perhaps the family became Methodist or Baptist for example.

Good luck anyway

Sue
x

Janet and Gwyn Thank you for the advice and support.
I will check all my info again later today and make notes for my visit. That way I'll be well prepared.
Di

Yes Di, if you look to see if they have settlement and removal orders for the parish that you have for him and check to see if he is listed there.

I think the system was in place until the reform of workhouses (1840s?) I googled for a description and came up with this.

Settlement: the Poor Law required the authorities of a parish to be responsible for the maintenance of poor people settled there. Settlement certificates were issued to those who moved to another parish. If the need for maintenance arose, the authorities could make a removal order to send them and their dependant’s back to their parish of origin, after carrying out an examination (or interrogation) as to their settlement. Settlement certificates, removal orders and settlement examinations may be found in the archives of Quarter Sessions courts and of parishes.

Like you, I would want to check for myself even though you've been told he's not there.
I agree that you will be more attuned to looking out for a name.
Having said that, I have hunted for over 10 years for the origins of a GGgrandfather. Each census gives the same birthplace and approx. birthyear.....but he was not baptised there according to PRs. I have searched parishes surrounding that village up to about a 10 mile radius, - not high populated as it was New Forest but still he can't be found.

I hope you have better luck.
I haven't given up, I keep thinking.... 'One day......

Gwyn

Janet
Sorry to sound stupid but do you mean the local Richmond RO? lol
Di

Don't know if you have considered settlement and removals orders in the local RO. They may have details of where he came from if not native to the parish.

Thanks for all the replies. He is said to be from Richmond Surrey and I know he was as he was head shepherd to King George the 3rd at Richmond. (I have books as proof) BUT I am aware that he may have travelled to Richmond to become the shepherd. He is my 4x Great Grandfather.
I'm really looking forward to the search for his birth 2nd marriage and death.
Di

You need to remember that most marriages took place in the bride's home village.

Even if the groom isn't recorded as being from another place there is always the possibility that he wasn't born where he married.

Even the bride may have been born and baptised elsewhere as many babies (especially first ones) were born where their mothers came from. I've seen lots of examples of where a young wife has gone home to mum to have her babies.
This can account for why a place of birth may not match baptism place.

It is sensible to start looking in ever increasing circles out from where you expect someone to be but even then they can pop up in totally new areas.

My 3x great grandfather married in and had children in a parish where I saw land records showing he owned a farm. I kept expecting to find earlier generations of the family in or around that place. I spent months in the local records office going through microfiches of parish records and gradually widening my search.

It wasn't until a few years later that I came across a will of a family member. By a very convoluted route involving tracing one person mentioned on the will I was able to track back from them and suddenly discovered the family on the other side of the county!

My 4x great grandfather had inherited some money and moved away from the village where he was born and I would never have realised.

Good luck
Sue

Michael
Thank you. You make good sense and I'd not looked at this as being a way of confirming he wasn't born when and where I thought.
I do some transcribing and am amazed when I see some entries for Ancestry that are obvious to me but are incorrectly transcribed so I will bear this in mind too when I'm there. I've looked forward to this trip so much I hope I don't disappoint myself. LOL
Di

Off to a local studies centre this week to try and find details of a relative who is ?b1767 but how realistic is it to expect to find him on parish records if the centre says he's not there when they have searched. I have his death date but no cert as it was early 1837 before registration. I know lots about him and that he had 2 wives but no birth details at all. IGI doesn't have anything concrete either.
I'm trying to be positive as I'm hoping I'll find something
Thanks
Di