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Patricia
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14 Dec 2014 11:44 |
Don't know if this could be of help to your tree my grandfather was George Frederick fretwell born1879 died 1930 married Florence Ellen East in 1909
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Sue in Sunny Worthing
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9 Nov 2007 17:59 |
Hello
Well, the birth certificate arrived this morning (a day early - well done GRO!!) and it confirms that we have the correct John William Fretwell and family in the censuses that you all kindly found for me.
Details are - 30th March 1876 at 35 Rathbone Street, Plaistow. John William Fretwell. Parents - Charles Fretwell, a Dock labourer, and Eliza Fretwell formerly Johnson.
But no clue as to why they changed their name to Cook - does anyone have any suggestion?
Sue
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Angela now in Wilts (not North Devon)
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3 Nov 2007 17:12 |
No wonder they preferred to be called Cook!
Yes I use Ancestry, exceedingly good value in my opinion.
Good luck.
Angela
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Sue in Sunny Worthing
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3 Nov 2007 16:32 |
This will make you smile .........
I've just found my Fretwell family in the 1871 census and they have been transcribed as FARTWELL !!!!!
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Sue in Sunny Worthing
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3 Nov 2007 16:12 |
Hi again
Maisy - you're great, thank you. Thats them!! I forgot to say that Margaret was born in Scotland, sorry.
Debi - GRO are posting cert on 9th November as soon as I receive it, I'll let you know & thanks for all of your help
Angela - what you did sounds so straight forward but do you use Ancestry? I'm registered with TheGenealogist which doesn't give me the options that you used - maybe I should change when my membership runs out? I've spent ages this afternoon using the info that you people have kindly given me and eventaully found the Fretwells on TheGenealogist transcribed as Tretwell is 1861 & Perchwell in 1871!!!
Sue
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Angela now in Wilts (not North Devon)
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3 Nov 2007 15:56 |
I've just got back from shopping & thought I'd have a look to see the progress. Well done all!
Just a tip Susan on how I found them, I suspect Debi did it in a similar way. Using the info Debi had found in 1871, I searched for a Charles (no surname), born 1846 Downham Norfolk, with a wife called Eliza, living in West Ham Essex. I then cross-referenced the other family members & reached the conclusion it was the same family.
Hope this helps.
Angela
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Debi Coone
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3 Nov 2007 15:41 |
Maisy I'd say it's a pretty good guess that it is.... well done :))
Susan I can't wait now till your BC comes... lol... it's like christmas. I'm sure it's not too sinister , perhaps Charles was illagitamate & hence the confusion of surnames mothers maybe fathers??
Much happiness Debi
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Maisy
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3 Nov 2007 15:18 |
I looked Margaret up on 1891 census and if it's the correct one she was born in Scotland. Wondering if this could be them on 1901 census, mistranscribed?
Name: William Tretwell Age: 25 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1876 Relation: Head Spouse's Name: Margaret Gender: Male Where born: London, Middlesex, England Civil Parish: West Ham Ecclesiastical parish: St Luke County/Island: Essex Country: England Street address:
Occupation:
Condition as to marriage:
Education:
Employment status: View Image Registration district: West Ham Sub-registration district: Canning Town ED, institution, or vessel: 24 Neighbors: View others on page Household schedule number: 356 Household Members: Name Age Margaret Tretwell 25 William Tretwell 25 William Tretwell 1
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Sue in Sunny Worthing
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3 Nov 2007 14:54 |
I've found birth of Kate Fretwell, 1874 Poplar George Fretwell, 1879 West Ham but no William Fretwell - so hopefully this is my John William, 1876 West Ham.
I have also found marriage of Charles Fretwell 1867 in Poplar
Fingers crossed that when I receive John William's birth certificate it will show his mother as Eliza!!
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Sue in Sunny Worthing
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3 Nov 2007 14:30 |
Just one more thing that I've thought of (and I hope I'm not pushing it!!) - by 1901 census John William Fretwell was married to Margaret. He may well have been at sea but where was Margaret? Was she Margaret Cook? They'd been married over 3 years and so could well have had a child by then? Would you mind a quick peek at 1901 for Margaret for me?
Thank you, Sue
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Sue in Sunny Worthing
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3 Nov 2007 14:23 |
Oooooh, I hope its nothing sinister!!! Lol
Its quite intriguing isn't it? Obviously something happened between 1871 & 1881 for them to change their name. I am going to look up the birth's of Kate, William & George to find out if i) William is my John William and ii) if they were registered as Fretwell.
I'm amazed at how you managed to find them as Cook when we only knew them as Fretwell - well done, I'm so impressed!!
I'll let you know if I trace those births in a bit & when the birth cert arrives, of course I'll let you know the details - shame we have to wait for these things!!
Sue
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Debi Coone
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3 Nov 2007 14:02 |
Your welcome
I do hope when you know for certain from the BC your able to fathom out if the above family are Fretwell's why they were recorded as Cook on the census details...... do let us know if & when you find out pls?
Much happiness Debi
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Sue in Sunny Worthing
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3 Nov 2007 13:54 |
Thank you so much for your help - I popped out to make a cup of tea & came back to all of these replies, how fantastic you are!!
I'm gonna drink my cuppa and have a quiet read of what you've found & come back to you in 10 minutes!!
Thanks again, Sue
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Debi Coone
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3 Nov 2007 13:53 |
Why did they revert to calling themselves COOK???
Here they are in 1901:
1901 England Census about Charles Cook
Name: Charles Cook Age: 60 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1841 Relation: Head Spouse's Name: Eliza Gender: Male Where born: Downham, Norfolk, England Civil Parish: West Ham Ecclesiastical parish: St Luke County/Island: Essex Country: England :
Registration district: West Ham Sub-registration district: Canning Town ED, institution, or vessel: 23
Household schedule number: 219 Household Members: Name Age Charles Cook 60 Eliza Cook 60
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Debi Coone
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3 Nov 2007 13:51 |
I know what your saying lol ....
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Angela now in Wilts (not North Devon)
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3 Nov 2007 13:51 |
I have a family in my tree who called themselves by a different surname in 1881/1891. I think it was because the husband was already married & they were trying to hide! The couple finally married when their oldest children were in their thirties & he was shown as a widower!
Angela
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Angela now in Wilts (not North Devon)
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3 Nov 2007 13:48 |
1891 - still calling themselves Cook!
Charles Cook Age: 44 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1847 Relation: Head Spouse's Name: Eliza Gender: Male Where born: Cambridgeshire, England Civil Parish: West Ham Ecclesiastical parish: St Mark Town: West Ham County/Island: Essex Country: England Street address:
Occupation:
Condition as to marriage:
Education:
Employment status: View Image Registration district: West Ham Sub-registration district: West Ham ED, institution, or vessel: 4 Neighbors: View others on page Household Members: Name Age Charles Cook 44 Eliza Cook 41 Elizabeth Cook 10 George Cook 12 Henry Cook 21 Kate Cook 17 William Cook 15 I surprise myself sometimes, debi. :-))
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Debi Coone
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3 Nov 2007 13:48 |
1891 England Census about Eliza Cook
Name: Eliza Cook Age: 41 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1850 Relation: Wife Spouse's Name: Charles Gender: Female Where born: Ely Civil Parish: West Ham Ecclesiastical parish: St Mark Town: West Ham County/Island: Essex Country: England
Registration district: West Ham Sub-registration district: West Ham ED, institution, or vessel: 4
Household Members: Name Age Charles Cook 44 Eliza Cook 41 Elizabeth Cook 10 George Cook 12 Henry Cook 21 Kate Cook 17 William Cook 15
Source Citation: Class: RG12; Piece: 1316; Folio 129; Page 60; GSU roll: 6096426.
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Maisy
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3 Nov 2007 13:45 |
Is this Charles in 1861?
Name: Charles Fretwell Age: 16 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1845 Relation: Son Father's Name: Henry Mother's Name: Sarah Gender: Male Where born: West Dereham, Norfolk, England Civil Parish: Downham Market and Wimbotsham Ecclesiastical parish: Fincham Town: Downham Market County/Island: Norfolk Country: England Street address:
Occupation:
Condition as to marriage: View Image Registration district: Downham Sub-registration district: Downham ED, institution, or vessel: 4 Neighbors: View others on page Household schedule number: 23 Household Members: Name Age Charles Fretwell 16 Eliza Fretwell 11 Henry Fretwell 42 Henry Fretwell 8 Martha Fretwell 6 Sarah Fretwell 41 Sarah Fretwell 6 William Fretwell 3
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Debi Coone
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3 Nov 2007 13:44 |
lol Angela what great detectives we are :))
Can't seem to find them in 1891 or 1901 at present... however there is a death for Charles Fretwell in 1902 in West Ham on the free bmd web site.
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