Find Ancestors

The census records where people lived and were born. No information on a census relates to where they married

Your OP says they married in Highworth, which is near Swindon, in Wiltshire

"Highworth is a market town and civil parish in Wiltshire, England, about 6 miles (10 km) northeast of Swindon town centre"

However, later info says they married in Rodbourne Cheney - again, near Swindon. Google for precise location

His address was Rodbourne Lane - hers was Waterfield Berks.

So it looks as though they married in 'his' Parish

Witnesses both named Hayes, so he had no-one.

I'm not convinced that the 'Shoemaker' is the same man as the 'Labourer'. Even if he had to take up labouring in an emergency due to unemployment, one would have expected that he would revert to his trade when he emigrated, which he clearly did not do, in view of all the records in Australia.

Another little query — The certified copy of the marriage registration of John Henry White and Caroline Hayes says "Marriage solemnized in The Parish Church ... in the County of Wiltshire", yet the Census records refer to Circencester, Gloucestershire.

Has the border between the counties changed over time, or did the parish boundaries cross borders?

Dea .. The parents of my Caroline (White) were George Hayes and Louisa Clarke. George, born c.1802, initially married Lucy Unknown. Children born 1832 to 1842 William, George, Rachel, Mary Ann and Martha. Louisa died in 1842 (same year as Martha was born). George then married Louisa Clarke. Children born 1845 to 1859 James, Richard, Jane, Caroline, Elizabeth and Edward.

Since both Carolines were born in Cirencester, there's probably a chance that they were related by way of George Hayes/Hays/Haines (as he is referred to in 1841 census. We might be 'whatsit' cousins!

Dea .. The parents of my Caroline (White) were George Hayes and Louisa Clarke. George, born c.1802, initially married Lucy Unknown. Children born 1832 to 1842 William, George, Rachel, Mary Ann and Martha. Louisa died in 1842 (same year as Martha was born). George then married Louisa Clarke. Children born 1845 to 1859 James, Richard, Jane, Caroline, Elizabeth and Edward.

Since both Carolines were born in Cirencester, there's probably a chance that they were related by way of George Hayes/Hays/Haines (as he is referred to in 1841 census. We might be 'whatsit' cousins!

With John Henry, labourer:

Caroline White
in the Australia, Electoral Rolls, 1903-1980
Name: Caroline White
Gender: Female
Electoral Year: 1917
Subdistrict: Bendigo
State: Victoria
District: Bendigo
Country: Australia
Residence Address: 8 Hopper St., Bendigo
Occupation: Home Duties


He's also a labourer in 1916, 1919, 1905, and any other years where I've found them,

Yes - that's the Caroline I was following - thank you AG.

Dea x

??

Caroline Hays
in the 1881 England Census
Name: Caroline Hays
Age: 27
Estimated birth year: abt 1854
Relationship to Head: Servant
Gender: Female
Where born: Cirencester, Gloucestershire, England <<<<<<<<<<
Civil Parish: St Georges Hanover
County/Island: London
Country: England
Street address: 35 36 Albemarle St
Occupation: Scullerymaid Domestic Ser
Registration district: Chelsea
ED, institution, or vessel: 2
Neighbors:
Piece: 95
Folio: 42
Page Number: 42

Caroline's father was George, labourer, per the marriage/banns record.


Possibly Caroline in 1871??

Caroline Hayes
in the 1871 England Census
Name: Caroline Hayes
Age: 18
Estimated birth year: abt 1853
Relation: Servant
Gender: Female
Where born: Cirencester, Gloucestershire, England
Civil Parish: Cirencester
Town: Cirencester
County/Island: Gloucestershire
Country: England
Registration district: Cirencester
Sub-registration district: Cirencester
ED, institution, or vessel: 2
Household schedule number: 55
Piece: 2646
Folio: 62
Page Number: 10
Household Members:
Name Age
Charlette Stratford 68
Caroline Hayes 18
William King 21
Samuel Crew 24
Thomas Millard 27
Edwin Trinder 18


Caroline Hayes
in the 1861 England Census
Name: Caroline Hayes
Age: 8
Estimated birth year: 1853
Relation: Daughter
Father's name: George Hayes
Mother's name: Louisa Hayes
Gender: Female
Where born: Cirencester, Gloucestershire, England
Civil Parish: Cirencester
County/Island: Gloucestershire
Country: England
Registration district: Cirencester
Sub-registration district: Cirencester
ED, institution, or vessel: 8
Neighbors:
Household schedule number: 59
Piece: 1782
Folio: 134
Page Number: 9
Household Members:
Name Age
George Hayes 57 - agricultural labourer
Louisa Hayes 43
Richard Hayes 14
Jane Hayes 10
Caroline Hayes 8
Elizabeth Hayes 5
Edward Hayes 2

Was Caroline's father called George and did she have a sister called Jane please?

If not, could you give me some details on her please, especially where she was in 1881, a while before her marriage?

Dea x

Goodness me! So much information that I wasn't expecting.

Sorry about the incorrect year of John Henry's marriage — a typo that I didn't notice.

As far as his occupation is concerned, I started off with his marriage to Caroline, then searched Census records. While his occupation at marriage was Labourer, the year before he was listed as Shoemaker. Hence my acceptance of the 1871 listing.

Haven't found any record of his occupation at Warragul, Victoria, but he ended up in Bendigo by at least 1914. The Electoral Roll of that year shows him as a Groom, while his 1926 Death cert gives his occupation as Labourer. I imagine he took on any work that he could find. Except that of shoemaker — if the immigration records are anything to go by, there was an awful lot of competition!

Neither here nor there, but daughter, Laura, was my grandmother.

Thank you all for the wonderful assistance you have given me. I'll head off in the direction of John White and Emma and see if I can prove "beyond reasonable doubt" that this is the connection.

Thank you Maryb - that answers my question but unfortunately gets me no further
:-| :-(

I have been working on something for a couple of days now but I can't quite connect it yet ! :-(

I will keep at it until I can prove that it does or does not connect !!!!!!!!!!

Dea x

Alice White in 1888 born Victoria Australia
May 1888 died 1889
laura louisa 1886 married Mr Marion
Henry James 1884 Victoria
Carol/Caroline 1891 married Stanley Edward Edmonds in 1910

Maryb.

Can you please tell us if John + Caroline had any further children in Australia and what were their names?

Do you have any mention of the boys christan name 'Squire' or the girl's name 'Lavinia' further down in the family?

Dea x

which helped to find the 1871 census referred to in the OP

1871 England, Wales & Scotland Census

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
William White Head - Male 38 1833 - Middlesex, England
Sarah White Wife - Female 41 1830 - Middlesex, England
William R White Son - Male 19 1852 - Middlesex, England
John White Son - Male 15 1856 - Middlesex, England
George White Son - Male 3 1868 - Middlesex, England

all born Shoreditch
William Senior is a Paper Hotpresser
William Junior is a wood Carver
John is an Errand Boy
-----------------------------

and same address and listed as Lodgers, but separately is a
John White aged 19 (b 1852) who is in the Boot and Shoe Trade and
Henry White aged 10 (b1861)
both born Shoreditch too

William and Sarah White seem to be at the Hows Street address in 1881 too

1881 England, Wales & Scotland Census
28, Hows Street, Shoreditch, London & Middlesex, England

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
William White Head Married Male 49 1832 Upholsterer Shoreditch, Middlesex, England
Sarah White Wife Married Female 50 1831 - Shoreditch, Middlesex, England
George White Son Single Male 13 1868 Scholar Shoreditch, Middlesex, England
William Bell Lodger - Male 65 1816 Seaman -

----------------------------------------
also at same address -

1881 England, Wales & Scotland Census
28, Hows Street, Shoreditch, London & Middlesex, England

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
John White Head Married Male 25 1856 Shoe Maker Shoreditch, Middlesex, England
Ann White Wife Married Female 25 1856 - Clerkenwell, Middlesex, England
Ann White Daughter Single Female 3 1878 - -
John White Son Single Male 1 1880 - Shoreditch, Middlesex, England

Born c1853 there may not be a birth record. You may find a baptism

The 1871 census you refer to is hardly likely to be your relation in view of his occupation. He is also somewhat older.........

The father's name on the marriage cert could be fiction - both witnesses are from the bride's side

John's address when he married was Rodbourne Road

He's still a labourer at Mabel's baptism.

Mabel White
in the Wiltshire, England, Church of England Births and Baptisms, 1813-1916
Name: Mabel White
Baptism Date: 30 Apr 1883
Baptism Place: Swindon, St Mark, Wiltshire, England
Parish as it Appears: Swindon
Father: John Henry White
Mother: Caroline White

I'm not seeing the 1871 census anywhere on Ancestry - have tried searching with any/all of the names you give.

Mabel baptised 30/4/1883 of 93,Westcott Place by John Henry and Caroline White his occupation a labourer.

Maryb

The marriage cert only says JH was a labourer - Why do you think he was a shoemaker? Is that from later records?