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I'd like suggestions re finding birth record of my g-grandfather, John Henry White. He married my g-grandmother, Caroline Hayes, in St Marys Anglican Church, Highworth, Wiltshire, in 1881. I purchased the marriage certificate but, unlike Australian certificates, only the fathers' names are recorded. A daughter Mabel, was born in 1883 and shortly after the family emmigrated to Australia.

The 1871 UK Census lists a John Henry white, Boot & Shoe Trade, aged 19, boarding at 28 Hows Street, Haggerton West, with William & Sarah White and their children. Also shown as a boarder is Henry White, Scholar, aged 10. Perhaps William is John Henry's uncle?

The 1881 UK Census - John Henry White, Shoemaker, aged 26 is boarding at 7 Queen Hill Cottages, Circenester - gives information that he was born at Middlesex, London.

John Henry died in Bendigo, Victoria, in 1926 - his parents' names are not listed on the death registration. Caroline had died in 1920 - perhaps there was no-one who knew the names of his parents.

I have found nothing which gives his date of birth, not even the Quarter, and have no idea of his mother's name. The marriage registration gives his father as John White, Sailor.

I'd appreciate any tips on finding which John White might be my g-g-grandfather and/or the name of my g-g-grandmama. I'm quite spoilt for choice.

Thank you in advance.

What was John's stated age at marriage? [ EDIT: found it - 28 ]

And just to verify - I'm assuming his occupation is shoemaker at marriage?

[ EDIT: No, it says he was a labourer.]

Who does the certificate name as his father, and his father’s occupation?
Have you identified who the witnesses were?

Civil registration didn’t start until 1837. It wasn’t compulsory to register a birth until 1873. It’s possible that his wasn’t.

Wombat says John Henry's father was John White, sailor.


For our reference:

John Henry White
in the 1881 England Census
Name: John Henry White
Age: 26
Estimated birth year: abt 1855
Relationship to Head: Boarder
Gender: Male
Where born: London, Middlesex, England
Civil Parish: Cirencester
County/Island: Gloucestershire
Country: England
Street address: 7 Queens Hill Cottages
Occupation: Shoemaker
Registration district: Cirencester
ED, institution, or vessel: 8
Neighbors:
Piece: 2555
Folio: 46
Page Number: 33
Household Members:
Name Age
Mary Ann Coates 57
John Henry White 26
Jane Ritchings 14
Oliver Bendall 35
James Bowett 18


John Henry White
in the Wiltshire, England, Church of England Marriages and Banns, 1754-1916
Name: John Henry White - labourer
Gender: Male
Age: 28
Birth Date: abt 1854
Marriage or Bann Date: 11 Jul 1882 [ not 1881 ]
Marriage or Bann Place: Rodbourne Cheney, Wiltshire, England
Parish as it Appears: Rodbourne Cheney
Father: John White - sailor
Spouse: Caroline Hayes

??????????????????
Name: John White
Age: 2
Estimated birth year: 1858
Relation: Son
Father's name: John White
Mother's name: Emma White
Gender: Male
Where born: London, Middlesex, England
Civil Parish: Westminster St Anne
Ecclesiastical parish: St Mary
County/Island: Middlesex
Country: England
Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

View image
Registration district: Strand
Sub-registration district: St Anne Soho
ED, institution, or vessel: 11
Neighbors:
Household schedule number: 90
Piece: 176
Folio: 5
Page Number: 15
Household Members:
Name Age
John White 45 ---- sailor born isle of man
Emma White 41 born livrpool
Samuel White 18 born liverpool
Fred White 13 b orn london
John White 2 born london


edit - fmp says occupation is tailor

The marriage cert only says JH was a labourer - Why do you think he was a shoemaker? Is that from later records?

Mabel baptised 30/4/1883 of 93,Westcott Place by John Henry and Caroline White his occupation a labourer.

Maryb

I'm not seeing the 1871 census anywhere on Ancestry - have tried searching with any/all of the names you give.

He's still a labourer at Mabel's baptism.

Mabel White
in the Wiltshire, England, Church of England Births and Baptisms, 1813-1916
Name: Mabel White
Baptism Date: 30 Apr 1883
Baptism Place: Swindon, St Mark, Wiltshire, England
Parish as it Appears: Swindon
Father: John Henry White
Mother: Caroline White

Born c1853 there may not be a birth record. You may find a baptism

The 1871 census you refer to is hardly likely to be your relation in view of his occupation. He is also somewhat older.........

The father's name on the marriage cert could be fiction - both witnesses are from the bride's side

John's address when he married was Rodbourne Road

William and Sarah White seem to be at the Hows Street address in 1881 too

1881 England, Wales & Scotland Census
28, Hows Street, Shoreditch, London & Middlesex, England

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
William White Head Married Male 49 1832 Upholsterer Shoreditch, Middlesex, England
Sarah White Wife Married Female 50 1831 - Shoreditch, Middlesex, England
George White Son Single Male 13 1868 Scholar Shoreditch, Middlesex, England
William Bell Lodger - Male 65 1816 Seaman -

----------------------------------------
also at same address -

1881 England, Wales & Scotland Census
28, Hows Street, Shoreditch, London & Middlesex, England

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
John White Head Married Male 25 1856 Shoe Maker Shoreditch, Middlesex, England
Ann White Wife Married Female 25 1856 - Clerkenwell, Middlesex, England
Ann White Daughter Single Female 3 1878 - -
John White Son Single Male 1 1880 - Shoreditch, Middlesex, England

which helped to find the 1871 census referred to in the OP

1871 England, Wales & Scotland Census

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
William White Head - Male 38 1833 - Middlesex, England
Sarah White Wife - Female 41 1830 - Middlesex, England
William R White Son - Male 19 1852 - Middlesex, England
John White Son - Male 15 1856 - Middlesex, England
George White Son - Male 3 1868 - Middlesex, England

all born Shoreditch
William Senior is a Paper Hotpresser
William Junior is a wood Carver
John is an Errand Boy
-----------------------------

and same address and listed as Lodgers, but separately is a
John White aged 19 (b 1852) who is in the Boot and Shoe Trade and
Henry White aged 10 (b1861)
both born Shoreditch too

Can you please tell us if John + Caroline had any further children in Australia and what were their names?

Do you have any mention of the boys christan name 'Squire' or the girl's name 'Lavinia' further down in the family?

Dea x

Alice White in 1888 born Victoria Australia
May 1888 died 1889
laura louisa 1886 married Mr Marion
Henry James 1884 Victoria
Carol/Caroline 1891 married Stanley Edward Edmonds in 1910

Maryb.

Thank you Maryb - that answers my question but unfortunately gets me no further
:-| :-(

I have been working on something for a couple of days now but I can't quite connect it yet ! :-(

I will keep at it until I can prove that it does or does not connect !!!!!!!!!!

Dea x

Goodness me! So much information that I wasn't expecting.

Sorry about the incorrect year of John Henry's marriage — a typo that I didn't notice.

As far as his occupation is concerned, I started off with his marriage to Caroline, then searched Census records. While his occupation at marriage was Labourer, the year before he was listed as Shoemaker. Hence my acceptance of the 1871 listing.

Haven't found any record of his occupation at Warragul, Victoria, but he ended up in Bendigo by at least 1914. The Electoral Roll of that year shows him as a Groom, while his 1926 Death cert gives his occupation as Labourer. I imagine he took on any work that he could find. Except that of shoemaker — if the immigration records are anything to go by, there was an awful lot of competition!

Neither here nor there, but daughter, Laura, was my grandmother.

Thank you all for the wonderful assistance you have given me. I'll head off in the direction of John White and Emma and see if I can prove "beyond reasonable doubt" that this is the connection.

Was Caroline's father called George and did she have a sister called Jane please?

If not, could you give me some details on her please, especially where she was in 1881, a while before her marriage?

Dea x

Caroline's father was George, labourer, per the marriage/banns record.


Possibly Caroline in 1871??

Caroline Hayes
in the 1871 England Census
Name: Caroline Hayes
Age: 18
Estimated birth year: abt 1853
Relation: Servant
Gender: Female
Where born: Cirencester, Gloucestershire, England
Civil Parish: Cirencester
Town: Cirencester
County/Island: Gloucestershire
Country: England
Registration district: Cirencester
Sub-registration district: Cirencester
ED, institution, or vessel: 2
Household schedule number: 55
Piece: 2646
Folio: 62
Page Number: 10
Household Members:
Name Age
Charlette Stratford 68
Caroline Hayes 18
William King 21
Samuel Crew 24
Thomas Millard 27
Edwin Trinder 18


Caroline Hayes
in the 1861 England Census
Name: Caroline Hayes
Age: 8
Estimated birth year: 1853
Relation: Daughter
Father's name: George Hayes
Mother's name: Louisa Hayes
Gender: Female
Where born: Cirencester, Gloucestershire, England
Civil Parish: Cirencester
County/Island: Gloucestershire
Country: England
Registration district: Cirencester
Sub-registration district: Cirencester
ED, institution, or vessel: 8
Neighbors:
Household schedule number: 59
Piece: 1782
Folio: 134
Page Number: 9
Household Members:
Name Age
George Hayes 57 - agricultural labourer
Louisa Hayes 43
Richard Hayes 14
Jane Hayes 10
Caroline Hayes 8
Elizabeth Hayes 5
Edward Hayes 2

??

Caroline Hays
in the 1881 England Census
Name: Caroline Hays
Age: 27
Estimated birth year: abt 1854
Relationship to Head: Servant
Gender: Female
Where born: Cirencester, Gloucestershire, England <<<<<<<<<<
Civil Parish: St Georges Hanover
County/Island: London
Country: England
Street address: 35 36 Albemarle St
Occupation: Scullerymaid Domestic Ser
Registration district: Chelsea
ED, institution, or vessel: 2
Neighbors:
Piece: 95
Folio: 42
Page Number: 42

Yes - that's the Caroline I was following - thank you AG.

Dea x