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There's a member's tree on Ancestry which says Ruth was Ruth Rolfe, 1795-1830.


John's death, according to that tree:

John Yelland
in the England & Wales, FreeBMD Death Index, 1837-1915
Name: John Yelland
Estimated birth year: abt 1829
Registration Year: 1880
Registration Quarter: Jul-Aug-Sep
Age at Death: 51
Registration district: Brixworth
Inferred County: Northamptonshire
Volume: 3b
Page: 79


And probate of his Will:

John Yelland
in the England & Wales, National Probate Calendar (Index of Wills and Administrations), 1858-1966
Name: John Yelland
Probate Date: 11 Aug 1880
Death Date: 26 Jul 1880
Death Place: Northamptonshire, England
Registry: Northampton

John Yelland
Personal Estate under £200.
11 August
Administration of the personal estate of John Yelland. late of Harlestone in the county of Northampton, schoolmaster, who dies on 26th July 1880 at Harlestone was granted at Northampton to Elizabeth Yelland of Harlestone, widow the relict.

Well, as proved by the birth/baptism records posted above, George, Harriet, and probably Mary, were William & Ann's children, not Edward & Ruth's

Hi there - thanks very much indeed again.
I have Edward and Ruth as having these children -

Mary b 1821
Elizabeth Anne b 1825
George b 1820
Harriet b 1822-d1826
Emma b 1827
JOHN (MY Great great Grandfather b.1828 - d 1880 ?)
Edward b 1830

They are a bit of a tangled lot eh ? I found somewhere that Edward was a labourer.. His Father William appears to have been a carpenter (possibly a ships carpenter) in Plymouth - Yelland is a common surname in Devon and Cornwall - but NOT up here in Scotland - for a long long time we were the only ones !)

William and Ann appear to have ended up living with John-schoolmaster (and wife Elizabeth) in Harlestone - schoolhouse - Northhants

Thanks for all your help

Pat

Oh, yes, here's John:


John Zelland
in the London, England, Births and Baptisms, 1813-1906
Name: John Zelland
Record Type: Baptism
Baptism Date: 24 Aug 1828
Father's name: Edward Zelland
Mother's name: Ruth Zelland
Parish or Poor Law Union: Hornsey St Mary
Borough: Haringey
Register Type: Parish Registers

Apart from Edward 1830, I can only find records of these children for Ruth & Edward:

Elizabeth Ann Yelland
in the London, England, Births and Baptisms, 1813-1906
Name: Elizabeth Ann Yelland
Record Type: Baptism
Baptism Date: 8 May 1825
Father's name: Edward Yelland
Mother's name: Ruth Yelland
Parish or Poor Law Union: Hornsey St Mary
Borough: Haringey
Register Type: Parish Registers



Emma Yelland
in the London, England, Births and Baptisms, 1813-1906
Name: Emma Yelland
Record Type: Baptism
Baptism Date: 28 Jan 1827
Father's name: Edward Yelland
Mother's name: Ruth Yelland
Parish or Poor Law Union: Hornsey St Mary
Borough: Haringey
Register Type: Parish Registers

What names do you have for their children?

Looking again at the 1841 census, and then searching a bit more, it appears that Mary, George F and Harriet are William & Ann's children. Don't know about John.
Edward does seem to be your Edward's son (birth record posted above).


?? YOB a bit out compared with 1841 census:
Mary Yelland
in the England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
Name: Mary Yelland
Gender: Female
Birth Date: 2 Feb 1817
Baptism Date: 26 Feb 1817
Baptism Place: Saint Mary Magdalene,Woolwich,Kent,England
Father: William Yelland
Mother: Ann
FHL Film Number: 307732, 307733, 307734


Harriet Yelland
in the London, England, Births and Baptisms, 1813-1906
Name: Harriet Yelland
Record Type: Baptism
Baptism Date: 10 Sep 1823
Father's name: William Yelland
Mother's name: Ann Yelland
Parish or Poor Law Union: Woolwich St Mary Magdalene
Borough: Greenwich
Register Type: Parish Registers


George Frederick Yelland
in the England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
Name: George Frederick Yelland
Gender: Male
Baptism Date: 3 Dec 1820
Baptism Place: Tunbridge, Kent, England
Father: William Yelland
Mother: Ann
FHL Film Number: 1469567
Reference ID: item 5 p 123


Looks like another daughter:

Mercy Yelland
in the London, England, Births and Baptisms, 1813-1906
Name: Mercy Yelland
Record Type: Baptism
Baptism Date: 26 Feb 1817
Father's name: William Yelland
Mother's name: Ann Yelland
Parish or Poor Law Union: Woolwich St Mary Magdalene
Borough: Greenwich
Register Type: Parish Registers

Yes - in fact you said it yourself in your opening post - Edward died 1835, and Ruth in 1830 - death records posted above.

As the children would have been very young when Edward and Ruth died, presumably William and Ann took charge of them and brought them up.
so it's more a question of their grandchildren living with them, rather than them living with the grandchildren.

Unless the marriage to Ruth Rolfe, posted above, is the correct one, I can't find any mention of Edward and Ruth either, apart from their deaths, and the births of some of the children.

I can't thank you all enough - I did have the name Ruth - as married to Edward - but I have no idea where I found it. I will read through your replies very carefully - but I have no records at all of Ruth or Edward other than their dates of birth and death and the possibly 7 children they had
Many many thanks- I went cross eyed yesterday thinking I had lost an entire generation. William and Anne (b1780)were the parents of Edward born 1802 - but I have no idea how William and Anne came to be living with their Grandchildren later and no sign of Edward andRuth - presumably they pre-deceased their parents ? I think their son John (MY ancestor) b1828 started as a footman but became a schoolmaster and the rest of the later ancestors went on to be schhoolmasters and Custos people in norfolk.
Thank you all very much again. Pat :-)

EDIT:
No, this isn't a clue after all.
George is actually William's son, not Edward's.


George F (see 1841 census above), appears to have been born in Tunbridge Wells - also in 1851-71 censuses:

George F. Yelland
in the 1881 England Census
Name: George F. Yelland
Age: 60
Estimated birth year: abt 1821
Relationship to Head: Head
Spouse: Hannah Yelland
Gender: Male
Where born: Tunbridge Wells, Kent, England
Civil Parish: Hornsey
County/Island: Middlesex
Country: England
Street address: 1 Nightingale Lane
Marital Status: Married
Occupation: Gardener (Dom)
Registration district: Edmonton
Sub registration district: Hornsey
ED, institution, or vessel: 2b
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 1374
Folio: 121
Page Number: 63
Household Members:
Name Age
George F. Yelland 60
Hannah Yelland 62

Is this a possibility for his marriage?? Hardly gives him time to have 7 children before 1830:

Edward Yelland
in the London, England, Marriages and Banns, 1754-1921
Name: Edward Yelland
Spouse: Ruth Rolfe
Record Type: Marriage
Event Date: 11 Jul 1824
Parish: St Marylebone
Borough: Westminster
Register Type: Parish Register

I know you'll have these, Patricia - this is just for our benefit:

Ruth Yelland
in the London, England, Deaths and Burials, 1813-1980
Name: Ruth Yelland
Record Type: Burial
Age: 35
Estimated birth year: abt 1795
Death Date: abt 1830
Burial Date: 8 Sep 1830
Burial Place: St Mary, Hornsey, England
Parish or Poor Law Union: St Mary, Hornsey
Borough: Haringey
Register Type: Parish Register



Edward Yelland
in the London, England, Deaths and Burials, 1813-1980
Name: Edward Yelland
Record Type: Burial
Age: 33
Estimated birth year: abt 1802
Death Date: abt 1835
Burial Date: 12 Nov 1835
Burial Place: St Mary, Hornsey, England
Parish or Poor Law Union: St Mary, Hornsey
Borough: Haringey
Register Type: Parish Register

That Edward 1830 is a son of "your" Edward, I see - which you will know already:

Edward Yelland

in the London, England, Births and Baptisms, 1813-1906
Name: Edward Yelland
Record Type: Baptism
Baptism Date: 17 Jan 1830
Father's name: Edward Yelland
Mother's name: Ruth Yelland
Parish or Poor Law Union: Hornsey St Mary
Borough: Haringey
Register Type: Parish Registers

Just for our ref -
William and Ann with (presumably) a grandson Edward - not that it helps find records of Edward 1802:

Edward Yelland
in the 1841 England Census

Name: Edward Yelland
Age: 10
Estimated birth year: abt 1831
Gender: Male
Where born: Middlesex, England
Civil Parish: Hornsey
Hundred: Ossulstone (Finsbury Division)
County/Island: Middlesex
Country: England
Registration district: Edmonton
Sub-registration district: Hornsey and Highgate
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 663
Book: 4
Folio: 34
Page Number: 16
Household Members:
Name Age
William Yelland 60
Ann Yelland 60
Mary Yelland 20
George F Yelland 20
Harriet Yelland 15
John Yelland 14
Edward Yelland 10
James Yelland 40 - this entry scored out on the image
James Boundry 40
John Watson 20
George W Gordon 2

For INFO

1851 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Nightingale Place, Hornsey, Edmonton, Middlesex, England

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Gender Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
William Yelland Head Married Male 72 1779 Carpenter Plymouth, Devon, England Transcription
Ann Yelland Wife Married Female 71 1780 - Woolwich, Kent, England Transcription
John Yelland Grand Son Unmarried Male 22 1829 Footman Hornsey, Middlesex, England Transcription

Where was JOHN born?

Totally stuck.
Trying to find Edward Yelland born 1802-d 1835 ? - married - possibly to a Ruth 1794-1830 and had 7 children- not all survived - and lived and worked then in Hornsy Middlesex possibly as a labourer..
He was the Father of my Great Great Grandfather JOHN YELLAND BORN 1828. Oddly I have records on a later census of Edward's parents William and Ann - who came from Plymouth where William was a carpenter. William and Anne LATER lived in NORTHANTS - at Harlestone I think with much younger generation of the family.

Come to a total dead end now ? Please help if you can - they were around before census records.