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Thanks Kucinta

UK, Naval Officer and Rating Service Records, 1802-1919

Name: Benj Thwaites
Gender: Male
Record Type: Entry Books of Certificates
Date Range: 1861 Oct - 1863 Oct

Had C.S.19239 in brackets after his name.

National Archives have a record:

Name Thwaites, Benjamin. Place of Birth: Clerkenwell, London. Continuous Service Number: 19239. Date of Volunteering: ...

Admiralty: Royal Navy Continuous Service Engagement Books. C.S. NUMBERS. 19201 - 19300.
Name Thwaites, Benjamin.
Place of Birth: Clerkenwell, London.
Continuous Service Number: 19239.
Date of Volunteering: 07 March 1855.
Date of Birth: 24 December 1838.
Held by: The National Archives - Admiralty, Navy, Royal Marines, and Coastguard
Date: 1853 - 1872
Reference: ADM 139/193/19239

So looks like he was born very end of 1838.

It costs £3.30 to download images of his record. The preview seems to show 3 pages of information.

http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/D7545000

Thank you for that Gritty

"London Standard - Friday 28 January 1853

Reuben Thwaites was charged by Mr Ward of Liverpool Street, baker, with having crawled into his shop, thrown himself across the counter and stolen 1£, 12s, 0 1/4d, out of the till. Alderman Wire sentenced the prisoner to imprisonment for 3 months and hard labour."
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Another article on this incident in Morning Post - Friday 28 January 1853 suggests the prisoner looked to be about 11 years of age-
"The father of the prisoner said that correction had been thrown away upon the unfortunate child, who was, there was every reason to believe, under the tuition of experienced thieves ..."

Morning Post - Thursday 15 September 1859

"THE LATE AFFAIR AT THE MOUTH OF THE PEIHO
LISTS OF KILLED AND WOUNDED

Fury
....
Benjamin Thwaites, Ordinary, Slightly"

presumably ordinary seaman, slightly wounded

Don't forget that many pieces of 1861 are missing, and a high proportion of those are for the Home Counties.

I posted a full list on a thread on here earlier this year.................not a thread I initiated, so I can't promise to find it.

Beverley I have just been reading it all and agree that Rueben was probably sent to Australia after his thieving exploits

It makes you wonder if he had a choice in it, he had 3 brothers and a Mum at home in 1855 although Ben went to sea that year and the older 2 got married not long after.

Very interesting reading.

If you look up the Royal Philanthropic Society Farm School you will see that it was a sort of liberal reform school for young offenders

A small group of British men who were concerned about the number of homeless children who earned a living on London streets by begging or stealing met in St Paul's Coffee House in 1788. The Duke of Leeds backed the men after the meeting and they set up The Philanthropic Society, (TPS) their aim being to aid the reformation of boys who had been engaged in criminal activities.

Some of the young boys were sent to Australia or New Zealand to get them away from bad influences and give them a chance for a new start.

http://www.geni.com/projects/Royal-Philanthropic-Society/14656

So it is perfectly feasible that young Reuben was sent to Australia after being caught thieving.

Yes they would have jailed a 14yr old so I will have a good guess that it is my Rueben, it would also be the year after his father died.


Thanks everybody for all your help much appreciated
:-D

Following on from Andrew's mention of prisoners in 1861:

Just a possibility - no age given - [BUT PROBABLY TOO MUCH OF A LONG SHOT]:

Reuben Waites
in the England & Wales, Criminal Registers, 1791-1892

Name: Reuben Waites
Date of Trial: 11 Sep 1854
Trial Year: 1854
Location of Trial: Clerkenwell, Middlesex, England
Sentence: Imprisonment - 12 months
Crime: Larceny in dwelling house
Date of Execution or Release:


If it's him, he would only have been 14 - would they have jailed a 14-yr-old at that time??

http://tinyurl.com/jwk8e3e

(Reuben Arrival on above newspaper snippet)

Chris :)

http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/search?adv=y

(Aus. Newspapers)


NSW BDM Online

Break in Service
Due to technical maintenance, Family History Search is expected to be unavailable from:
•7pm Friday 17 April to 7pm Sunday 19 April 2015.

http://www.bdm.nsw.gov.au/Pages/family-history/family-history.aspx

?????

Australia, Death Index, 1787-1985



Name:Reuben Thwaites
Death Date:1888
Death Place:New South Wales
Registration Year:1888
Registration Place:Parramatta, New South Wales
Registration Number:8323


Andy

Just a possibility:

Thwaites alias Waites, Reuben Born: 1840, DOA: 17.1.1855. Notes: Emigrated to Adelaide per "Anne McLean", handout, birth given as December plus notes. reference: 2271/10/10 Folio: 193

http://www.geni.com/projects/Royal-Philanthropic-Society-Farm-School-Redhill-Emigrants-to-Australia/14657

http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C9102476

Benjamin THWAITE; Rating; Age on entry: [Not Given]; Dates served: [Not Given]; Date and Type of Application: Whitehall 3 June 1863. For the additional following details Born: 24 December 1838, Clerkenwell, London,

Name Thwaites, Benjamin
Place of Birth: Clerkenwell, London
Continuous Service Number: 19239
Date of Volunteering: 07 March 1855
Date of Birth: 24 December 1838

(could relate)

Chris :)

All UK, Naval Medal and Award Rolls, 1793-1972 (Ancestry)

Name: Benjn Thwaite
Medal or Award: China Medal
Service Year: 1856-1860
Service Location: China
Campaign or Service: Second China War
Ship Name: Fury

Ben was a seaman on wedding cert

What was Benjamin's occupation and residence on his marriage certificate?

There is R T and B T of about the right ages in 1861 as prisoners. Cant see anything in the criminal records for ID


Name:R T
Age:21
Estimated Birth Year:1840
Relation: Prisoner (Institutional)
Gender:Male
Where born:London, Middlesex, England
Civil Parish:Clerkenwell
Cunty/Island:Middlesex
Country:England
Street address:
Occupation:
Condition as to marriage:
View image
Registration district:Clerkenwell
Sub-registration district:Amwell

ED, institution, or vessel:
Middlesex House of Correction Cold Bath Fields

Neighbors:
View others on page
Household schedule number:1
Piece:194
Folio:131
Page Number:10


Andy

Sorry, I can't see either Reuben or Benjamin in 1861 - so far.

ArgyllGran I in my grey moment had automatically presumed the 1841 census was in April. June does make Rueben Stephen Thwaites a possible but I can´t even find him, not a census nor a death.

I don't see Reuben Stephen in any censuses at all, so I think that could be him. The date of the 1841 census was 6th June, so if he was born in early January, or maybe even end of December 1840, he would have been 6 months old at the census.

Births Mar 1841 (>99%)
Thwaites Reuben Stephen Islington 3 172
Thwaits Reuben Stephen Islington 3 172