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stewart45
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17 Feb 2015 23:32 |
Thanks very much for all your time and effort,I will print off the findings and give to Margaret.Sorry for the delay, I'm waiting for a new computer&dongle as my last one was stolen. Stewart ;-)
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JoonieCloonie
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13 Feb 2015 21:21 |
Well shoot :-)
I was in a big rush and didn't look any farther. Good thing you did!
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alviegal
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13 Feb 2015 20:33 |
Joonie, this appears to be your Fred in 1901.
Name: Fred White Age: 34 Estimated birth year: abt 1867 Relation to Head: Head Gender: Male Spouse: Isabella White Birth Place: Ossett, Yorkshire, England Civil Parish: Hanley Ecclesiastical parish: Hope Holy Trinity County/Island: Staffordshire Fred White 34 Isabella White 27 Lois White 9 Ada White 8 Harriet Pearson 18
So can't be the one we are looking for. Shame.
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alviegal
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13 Feb 2015 20:25 |
I have no idea if this has any relevance but it is in the area that the father lived in.
Victoria Deaths 1836-1985 Transcription
Learn more Print transcription Attach to tree First name(s) John William Last name White Age 64 Sex Male Birth year 1818 Death year 1882 Father's name John William Mother's name Elizabeth Mary Death place Ballarat East State Victoria Registration number 10669
I suppose he is old enough to have had 2 sons before Frederick and possibly daughters as well. He has also died before Fred's marriage.
I know this is a very loose connection. :-D
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JoonieCloonie
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13 Feb 2015 12:55 |
now that is actually a useful clue because 'Louie' is a name (although it could be a misprint) ... it's found in my family tree in the mid-late 1800s
the only Louie White birth in England 1855-1875 was
Births Sep 1868 WHITE Louie Hunslet 9b 306
......... but no Frederick White birth reg there 1860-1870
this seems to be her in 1891 in Headingly with Burley, Leeds, Yorkshire
John G White 29 book keeper Mary E White 48 Louie White 22 Clara White 19 James H White 15 George H White 13 Lillian White 12
wait!
1881
Name: Fred White Age: 14 Estimated birth year: abt 1867 Relationship to Head: Son Father: John White Mother: Martha White Gender: Male Where born: Ossett, Yorkshire, England Civil Parish: Soothill County/Island: Yorkshire Registration district: Dewsbury
John White 57 Martha White 56 Smith White 25 William White 21 > Louie White 17 > Fred White 14
Births Jun 1866 ? White Fred Dewsbury 9b 625
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Karin
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13 Feb 2015 06:44 |
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/46796208?searchTerm=%22frederick%20bird%20white%22&searchLimits=
Notice asks Frederick Bird White of Ballarat to contact his sister Louie (Louise?) in Melbourne. Dated 8/7/1887 in the South Australian Register.
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alviegal
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12 Feb 2015 21:18 |
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/47263241?searchTerm=%27frederick%20bird%20white%27&searchLimits=l-state=South+Australia
A little bit of extra information.
The marriage notice states he was the third son of the late John William White, Ballarat. Agnes was the third daughter of Henry waters of Booleroo Centre.
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alviegal
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12 Feb 2015 20:42 |
Here is his marriage. Don't think it's been added yet?
First name(s) Frederick Bird Last name White Marital status Single/Spinster Age 25 Birth year 1865 Marriage year 1890 Marriage date 23 Oct 1890 Place BC Church Franklin St Adelaide District Adelaide State South Australia Country Australia Father's first name(s) John William Father's last name White Spouse's first name(s) Agnes Spouse's last name Waters Spouse's marital status Single/Spinster Spouse's age 20 Spouse's birth year 1870 Spouse's father's first name(s) Henry Spouse's father's last name Waters Registration number 165/430
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Chris Ho :)
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12 Feb 2015 20:42 |
PROBATES GRANTED. Northern Argus (Clare, SA : 1869 - 1954) Friday 21 February 1936 Frederick Bird White, Malvern
LAW COURTS. INSOLVENCY COURT—ADELAIDE. The Advertiser (Adelaide, SA : 1889 - 1931) Saturday 15 January 1898 Frederick Bird White, of Port Adelaide, fruiterer
(if relating, worth a look on below)
http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/search?adv=y
http://www.aca.sa.gov.au/RecordsSearch.aspx
(above for Cheltenham Cemetery online)
Chris :)
edits (although, did notice Jacqueline's question wasn't answered from last posting 28 Jan 2015 11:24!)
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SylviaInCanada
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12 Feb 2015 20:16 |
hmmmmmm
that birth registration for Frederick B White shows on ancestry as registered in 1871 ????
Name: Frederick B White Registration Year: 1871 Registration Quarter: Oct-Nov-Dec Registration district: Hendon Inferred County: Middlesex Volume: 3a Page: 98
I looked for Fred* B White 1866 +/- 5 ....... so it should have picked up the 1966
The page image is headed Oct - Nov - Dec 1871 ........... but Frederick B White is not on that image, the surnames all begin with S
I cannot find any names later than beginning with T ....................... so there is something seriously wrong with that record on ancestry
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JoonieCloonie
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12 Feb 2015 18:35 |
so to work out the story from the very helpful but hard to follow copy&pastes ;)
Frederick Bird White married Agnes Waters in Adelaide in 1890 he died in Adelaide in 1935 at age 70, so born about 1865
their son Frederick John White was born in Adelaide in 1894 he married twice - Linda Olive Wilson in Norwood in 1926 who died in 1930 - Ada Queenie Blunt in Adelaide in 1936 he died in 1971 in Adelaide, wife named as Ada Queenie White
so Frederick Bird White did not marry Ada Queenie Blunt ... his son did, the year after Frederick Bird White himself died
this is the only possible Frederick B White birth 1863-1867 to fit those details
Births Jun 1866 White Frederick B Hendon 3a 98
(unusual for a birth in that era to show a middle initial rather than a name)
there is also no birth registered for a White with the middle name Bird ... and too many possibilities for a marriage of a Mr White to a Ms Bird (as one possibility for the name) to identify one
Just not possible to identify a Frederick White in censuses even to match that one
but aha, there are a few people named Bird White in censuses
Name: Jane Bird White Spouse: Abraham Flann White Birth: abt 1875 - Wyke Regis, Dorset, England Marriage: 1897 Residence: 2 Apr 1911 - Portland, Dorset, England son: William Bird White, born 1898 Portland
Name: Margaret Bird White Birth: abt 1835 - Dalkeith, Midlothian Residence in 1861: Wilton, Roxburghshire
Name: Jane Bird White Birth: abt 1811 - Ayr, Ayr Residence in 1861: Dalkeith, Dalkeith, Midlothian
and in fact there are 9 England/Wales BMD records for White with middle name Bird, just none that seem to relate
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Karin
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12 Feb 2015 18:11 |
From GenealogySA Death Index YEAR REG SURNAME GIVEN NAME RELATIVE NAME DISTRICT FIND OUT MORE 1935 576/29 WHITE Frederick Bird undefined Adelaide
South Australia Cemeteries RESTING PLACE SURNAME GIVEN NAME AGE YEAR FIND OUT MORE Cheltenham WHITE Frederick Bird 70y 1935
Death Index YEAR REG SURNAME GIVEN NAME RELATIVE NAME DISTRICT FIND OUT MORE 1953 795/1961 WHITE Agnes Frederick Bird WHITE [DH] Robe
YEAR REG SURNAME GIVEN NAME SPOUSE SURNAME SPOUSE GIVEN NAME DISTRICT 1890 165/430 WHITE Frederick Bird WATERS Agnes Adelaide
Birth Index YEAR SURNAME GIVEN NAME FATHER NAME MOTHER NAME DISTRICT REG 1894 WHITE Frederick John Frederick Bird WHITE Agnes WATERS Adelaide 537/130
Marriage Index YEAR REG SURNAME GIVEN NAME SPOUSE SURNAME SPOUSE GIVEN NAME DISTRICT 1926 307/584 WHITE Frederick John WILSON Linda Olive Norwood 1936 365/753 WHITE Frederick John BLUNT Ada Queenie Adelaide
Death Index YEAR REG SURNAME GIVEN NAME RELATIVE NAME DISTRICT 1971 123A/2854 WHITE Frederick John Ada Queenie WHITE [W] Adelaide
Death Index YEAR REG SURNAME GIVEN NAME RELATIVE NAME DISTRICT FIND OUT MORE 1930 523/72 WHITE Linda Olive Frederick John WHITE [H] Barossa
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Jacqueline
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28 Jan 2015 11:24 |
Does your friend know when her father was born?
You can't hope to trace his heritage until you have that info
One of his marriage certs would seem to be essential
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stewart45
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28 Jan 2015 07:00 |
Hi again,that marriage between fred & Agnes was in Adelaide S. Aust in 1890. I think Margaret is a bit confused,but what can you do? The main certificates are in the BD&M offices in Adelaide and not cheap to buy.Her father married( 2nd time ) a Ada Queenie Blunt.(much younger).Not sure if she is her Mother or not. If you can't help anymore that's alright, thanks very much for all your help and advice. Stewart
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stewart45
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28 Jan 2015 06:36 |
Thanks ladies for your input, food for thought with the Albert theory.She did say they were well off as they came to Australia with three to four servants,maybe a bit later than 1900.I'm not a member of ancestry now but I did see a Frederick Bird White married to a Agnes Waters, his Father was John William White.I'll check the shipping lists for 1900-1910 if I can get in.Thanks again Stewart from OZ
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SylviaInCanada
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28 Jan 2015 04:32 |
it really is almost hopeless, unless your friend can remember the name(s) of the wife of Frederick B* White
Could Bird have been mis-heard for "Bert", short of Albert or Hubert ................. there are 2 or 3 Fred* Whites with Albert as a second name
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SylviaInCanada
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28 Jan 2015 04:29 |
This, I think, the baptism for the Frederick Burt White that JoonieC found ..................
England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
Name: Frederick Roberts Burt White Gender: Male Baptism Date: 3 May 1883 Baptism Place: St. Marys, Reading, Berkshire, England Father: Sydney Victor White Mother: Elizabeth White FHL Film Number: 1040619 Reference ID: item 2 p 72
that seems quite late for someone to marry and have children and leave the UK around 1900???
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JoonieCloonie
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28 Jan 2015 03:51 |
hi Stewart, could he be Frederick Burt White?
Births Jun 1882 White Frederick Burt Reading 2c 364
http://www.freebmd.org.uk/cgi/search.pl
on a quick search at Freebmd there is no marriage for that name (or Bird)
but your friend must know the wife's name (if only her given name) and the names of children, and this is kind of essential for identifying the right people in records
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stewart45
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28 Jan 2015 02:14 |
Frederick Bird White born around 1878 ?England,married with children.All left England to come to Adelaide S.Aust. around 1900.The son Frederick John White is the father of an old friend who wants to know about the past in England.I'm a bit stuck so asking for help to help her.Regards Stewart
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