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I need to find if the above are related to my family Tree. These ladies both married into the Baker family (Frederick b 1871 and Henry b 1891) Bethnal Green area. My own connection is with the Cubitts, namely I am the Granddaughter of Elizabeth Cubitt b 1884 who married William Robery.

I am in touch with a Catherine Hope (married name) b1949 who is from the Cubitt/Baker line and I would like to know whether or not we are related. The Census' have not proved helpful and I would so appreciate your help.....the suspense is killing me! Thanking you in anticipation.

Just putting for our benefit, for an idea of location:

Marriages Sep 1906 (>99%)
CUBITT Elizabeth Mary A Romford 4a 860
ROBERY William Romford 4a 860

The only way is to trace both lines back, and look for a common ancestor - if related, this will happen eventually. You only need to trace the male Cubitts, so it could be worse!
Jan

A family on Ancestry has Elizabeth Mary Ann Cubitt as sister of a Florence Laura who married Henry Ernest Baker.
Jan

Can I just ask where you got the info about Hilda, as I'm not seeing her?
Jan

Marriages Jun 1903
Baker Henry Romford 4a 704
Cubitt Florence Laura Romford 4a 704



London, England, Births and Baptisms, 1813-1906

Name: Florence Laura Cubitt
Record Type: Baptism
Baptism Date: 12 Nov 1882
Father's Name: Charles Cubitt
Mother's name: Mary Ann Cubitt
Parish or Poor Law Union: Stepney St Thomas
Borough: Tower Hamlets
Register Type: Parish Registers

Father a printer

NOTE This Florence born c1882, NOT c1894 as in opening post, but that does mean she was old enough to marry in 1903, in same reg district as Elizabeth Mary Ann married in 1906 (as posted earlier by Jan)


Name: Elizabeth Mary Anne Cubitt
Record Type: Baptism
Baptism Date: 10 Feb 1884
Father's Name: Charles Cubitt
Mother's name: Mary Anne Cubitt
Parish or Poor Law Union: Stepney St John the Evangelist
Borough: Tower Hamlets
Register Type: Parish Registers

Father a printer, address 80 Christina St.


Census 1891:

Name: Florence Cubitt
Age: 9
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1882
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Charles Cubitt
Mother's name: Mary A Cubitt
Gender: Female
Where born: London, England
Civil Parish: Bermondsey
Ecclesiastical parish: St Mary Magdalene
Town: Southwark
County/Island: London
Country: England


Registration district: St Olave Southwark
Sub registration district: St Mary Magdalen
ED, institution, or vessel: 11

Piece: 373
Folio: 69
Page Number: 4

Household Members:
Name Age
Charles Cubitt 31 c1860 London, England
Mary A Cubitt 29
Florence Cubitt 9 c1882 London, England
Elizabeth Cubitt 7 c1884 London, England
Charles Cubitt 4
Beatrice Cubitt 2
Frederick Cubitt 1 Month


No sign of Hilda, and she would predate the marriage if born in 1879:

Name: Mary Ann Bunney<<<<<<<<<<<
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1860
Age: 21
Spouse: Charles Cubitt<<<<<<<<<< Printer
Spouse Age: 22
Record Type: Marriage
Event Date: 31 Jul 1881
Parish: St John the Evangelist, Stepney
Borough: Tower Hamlets
Father Name: Frederick John Bunney - carman
Spouse Father: Robert William Cubitt - draper
Register Type: Parish Register

I really don't see where Hilda fits in at all:

Census 1901:

1901 England, Wales & Scotland Census T
15, Victoria Road, Barking, Romford, Essex, England

Charles Cubitt Head Married Male 42 1859 Printer London, England
Mary A Cubitt Wife Married Female 40 1861 - London, England
Florence Cubitt Daughter Single Female 18 1883 Labeller London, England<<<<<
Elizabeth Cubitt Daughter Single Female 17 1884 Bagmaker Canvas London, England<<<<<
Charles R Cubitt Son - Male 14 1887 Layer On The Machine London, England
Beatrice Cubitt Daughter - Female 12 1889 - London, England
Frederick Cubitt Son - Male 10 1891 - London, England
Alfred Cubitt Son - Male 8 1893 - London, England
Albert Cubitt Son - Male 6 1895 - London, England
Lilian Cubitt Daughter - Female 4 1897 - London, England
Arthur Cubitt Son - Male 2 1899 - London, England

EDIT: OK a HILDA at last, but NOT born 1879....

1911:

1911 England, Wales & Scotland Census

62 Harpour Road Barking Essex, Barking, Essex, England

Charles Charles Cubitt Head Married Male 50 1861 Drury Lane London Letter Press Machine Minder
Mary Anne Cubitt Wife Married Female 48 1863 Aldgate Middlesex
Frederick Joseph Cubitt Son Single Male 20 1891 Bermondsey London Soldier nAlfred James Cubitt Son Single Male 18 1893 Bermondsey London General Labourer
Albert George Cubitt Son Single Male 16 1895 Bermondsey London General Labourer
Lillian Maud Cubitt Daughter - Female 14 1897 Bermondsey London -
Arthur Horace Cubitt Son - Male 12 1899 Bermondsey London School
Hilda Alexander Cubitt Daughter - Female 8 1903 Barking Essex School <<<<<<<<<<;
Edith Alice Cubitt Daughter - Female 7 1904 Barking Essex School

Married 30 years 8 children born, 1 deceased by time of census.

This seems to be Henry and Florence in 1911, their ages don't tally at all with Rita's opening post and header.

I can't find a marriage for a Hilda nee Cubitt to a Baker at all, at least not under her maiden name.

The only Florence Cubitt - Henry Baker marriage I can find is the 1903 one, which tallies with Florence being Elizabeth Mary Ann's sister, and the marriage is in the same district as Elizabeth Mary Ann's, but not with the ages given by Rita.

Henry doesn't have the name Ernest attached in either the BMD marriage index or census 1911, as per the Ancestry tree Jan mentioned. Taking a quick look at the trees on Ancestry, there might be a bit of confusion over Henry Bakers born in Bermondsey (On the census below the word 'Bermondsey', is written under Cable Street, but in the space for Henry's birthplace, so it's not clear if Bermondsey applies to Cable Street, or Layard Road, or both).

It's also possible I have the wrong Henry and Florence in the census; the census does say married 9 years, 3 children born and all still living.


Census 1911:

Name: Florence Baker
Age in 1911: 25
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1886
Relation to Head: Wife
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Cable Street
Civil Parish: Bermondsey
County/Island: London
Country: England
Street address: 144 St James Rd S E
Marital Status: Married
Years Married: 9
Estimated Marriage Year: 1902
Registration district: St Olave (Bermondsey)
Registration District Number: 24
Sub-registration district: Bermondsey
ED, institution, or vessel: 27
Piece: 1895

Household Members:
Name Age
Henry Baker 30 c1881 Layard Road
Florence Baker 25
Florrie Baker 3
Lilian Baker 0
Henry Baker 7

I think Hilda Alexander/Alexandra Cubitt, married in India to a Mr Harris:

British India Office Ecclesiastical Returns - Marriages

First name(s) Hilda Alexander
Last name Cubitt
Marriage year 1931
Marriage date 1931
Spouse's first name George James
Spouse's last name Harris
Place Bombay
Presidency Bombay
Groom's age 39
Bride's age 28
Groom's father's first name -
Groom's father's last name -
Bride's father's first name -
Bride's father's last name -
Catalogue description Parish register transcripts from the Presidency of Bombay, 1709-1948, :


UK, Outward Passenger Lists, 1890-1960

Name: Hilda Cubitt
Gender: Female
Age: 28
Birth Date: abt 1903<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Departure Date: 2 Apr 1931
Port of Departure: Liverpool, England
Destination Port: Bombay, India
Ship Name: Britannia
Search Ship Database: Search for the Britannia in the 'Passenger Ships and Images' database
Shipping line: Anchor Line (Henderbon Brothers) Limited
Official Number: 148894
Master: Halder

Her address in England was Barking, Essex.

I have all the information on my grandmother Elizabeth 1884 and her siblings including Florence EMILY 1883 as I have it, who died in 1955,and at the time of my researching, T thought may have married an Ernest Shaw. At a later date I was contacted by a lady via GR stating that she was the granddaughter of Florence Emily (with the year of birth 1883) and that Florence had married a Baker! It was she that sent me the photographs I mentioned depicting Hilda,Florence, Frederick and Henry so that can't be wrong. If Florence is my Grandmother's sister (and I can see a resemblance) why do the dates not tally?

With regards to Hilda - yes - she married George Harris and they had two daughters (born in India) and we were in contact while researching.

So, where do we go from here folks? With thanks....

But you said Hilda was born 1879, and the Hilda who went out to India and married George Harris was born in 1903...(she was the child of Elizabeth Mary Ann Cubitt's and Florence Laura Cubitt's parents according to census 1911)

The baptisms I posted earlier show that both Florence LAURA Cubitt and Elizabeth Mary Ann Cubitt were baptised as the children of Charles Cubitt, printer, and wife Mary Ann or Mary Anne, in Stepney.

The marriage I posted also shows Florence LAURA Cubitt marrying a Henry Baker in Romford reg district in 1903.

You were the one who said Florence was born in 1894 in your thread heading, where you also said Hilda was born in 1879.

This looks like Florence's birth:

Births Jun 1882 Cubitt Florence Laura St. Geo. East 1c 397

which ties in with her being baptised in a Stepney church, as St George in the East reg district was abolished in 1926 to become part of Stepney reg district.

It's also the same district Mary Ann Elizabeth Cubitt was born in:

Births Mar 1884 Cubitt Elizabeth Mary A St. Geo. East 1c 386

Florence EMILY Cubitt was registered in Westminster:

Births Dec 1882 Cubitt Florence Emily Westminster 1a 507

I've found Florence Emily Cubitt's baptism, in Westminster where her birth was registered.

As you can see, her parents are NOT Elizabeth Mary Ann Cubitt's parents Charles Cubitt, Printer and Mary Ann....

Westminster Baptisms

First name(s) FLORENCE EMILY
Last name CUBITT
Birth year 1882
Baptism year 1882
Baptism day 15
Baptism month Dec
Parish St Peter, Great Windmill Street
Father's first name(s) Thomas<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Mother's first name(s) Eleanor<<<<<<<<<<<<<
County Middlesex
Page 134
Record set Westminster Baptisms
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
Record collection Births & baptisms


The family's address was 2 Archer Street, and Thomas Cubitt's occupation is recorded as butcher.

Births Dec 1882 Cubitt Florence Emily Westminster 1a 507

Thank you so much for your help and expertise .. I shall look into the alternatives you have advised tomorrow - its better when refreshed by the cold light of day !.

Births Mar 1903 (>99%)
-------------------------------------------------------
Cubitt Hilda Alexandra Romford 4a 617


(aged 28 on 1931 Marriage posted above, Parent on below)


Location St. Joseph's Cathedral, Allahabad
Type of record Baptism (parents)
Year 1932
Man's First Name George James
Woman's First Name Hilda Alexandria
Surname Harris
Occupation Ordnance.
City Allahabad

Location St. Joseph's Cathedral, Allahabad
Type of record Baptism (parents)
Year 1935
Man's First Name George John
Woman's First Name Hilda Alexandria
Surname Harris
Occupation Ordnance.
City Allahabad

Chris :)


http://search.fibis.org/frontis/bin/aps_person_search.php

(from above, Records held at British Library, London (India Office)

Good morning.. Oh dear, this isn't good news is it - not what I wanted to hear at all. Sharing my enthusiasm of GR family trees with a close friend (Catherine Hope 1949) we discovered that we both shared Cubitts/Bakers ( even their first names) and from roughly the same area, it was just the dates that were the stumbling block. Having had two fantastic success in my previous research in my maternal Trees (Perkins/Young) I found three cousins that were 'unknown' of through adoption and now back within the family, and further, to my utter amazement, on the other side, a cousin who lived in the next street and whose children went to the same school as mine and knew each other from their teenage years. And, to top it all, I had met a Perkins cousin on numerous occasions, not knowing who he was, as it transpires his wife and I were in our local pub's ladies darts team !! So looks like I won't be achieving a 'hat trick' after all. Woe is me... In any event people thank you so much for your help and I must tell my 'nearly cousin' that she is still just 'a good friend'. Thanks to you all - you have been very helpful. Rita

Good morning.. Oh dear, this isn't good news is it - not what I wanted to hear at all. Sharing my enthusiasm of GR family trees with a close friend (Catherine Hope 1949) we discovered that we both shared Cubitts/Bakers ( even their first names) and from roughly the same area, it was just the dates that were the stumbling block. Having had two fantastic success in my previous research in my maternal Trees (Perkins/Young) I found three cousins that were 'unknown' of through adoption and now back within the family, and further, to my utter amazement, on the other side, a cousin who lived in the next street and whose children went to the same school as mine and knew each other from their teenage years. And, to top it all, I had met a Perkins cousin on numerous occasions, not knowing who he was, as it transpires his wife and I were in our local pub's ladies darts team !! So looks like I won't be achieving a 'hat trick' after all. Woe is me... In any event people thank you so much for your help and I must tell my 'nearly cousin' that she is still just 'a good friend'. Thanks to you all - you have been very helpful. Rita