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I have looked at the 1881 census again....Emma is listed as Emma Davies a coalminers wife.....I can't help but wonder if the census taker assumed she was married to Thomas Davies and did not ask her her married name.....if so where was William?....Emma's sister Jane (married to Stephen Sanger) lived not far from Emma in 1881. (Sorry don't have the census record in front of me...anyways it is possible the William and Emma moved to Wales close to Jane.....Emma did not have a legal marriage with Thomas Davies until 1894, even though she had 2 children with him, James And Bertha (I have both of their birth certs.).......Did William and Emma part company in Wales?...I realize life was very difficult for a single mother so remarrying quickly was the norm. So why wait until 1894 to marry the father of 2 of your children????? So wish I could go back in time and ask Emma!
I know that Emma and her family attended Methodist churches.....So many questions and so few answers!
There is also the fact that my grandfather James changed his name from Davies to Powell after 1905.....Did he find out that Emma was still legally married to William Powell when he was born and changed it after Thomas Davies died.......so sad there is no one still living from my dad's family who knows....Bertha never changed her last name and is listed on her marriage cert as Bertha Davies...

unlikely.....on the parish record it states his occupation as a laborer, it also lists his fathers name as william.........I believe I will order the marriage cert and see if there is any other clues on it..

http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/D6585197

Name Powell, William
Official Number: 47378
Place of Birth: Sheet near Petersfield, Hampshire
Date of Birth: 27 May 1841


(further investigation of that 1871 posted, to get more details, looks to be above!)

1871 (Find My Past)
First name(s) William
Last name Powell
Relationship Lg Seaman
Age 29
Birth year 1842
Marital Status Single
Birth county Hampshire
Birth county as transcribed HAMPSHIRE
County Royal Navy At Sea and in Ports Abroad
Ships and Overseas Establishments
Vessel name Bristol, Of Anchor In Funchal Bay, Island Of Madeira
Archive reference RG10
Piece number 5779
Folio 111
Page 3

Chris :)

They had one Son, Thomas Henry...I have been in contact with his descendants and on his marriage cert. it states father was deceased and had been a sculptor....

Strange but I did recheck free bmd and now I see that the marriage shows up......Will check that census record and see if I can figure out what happened to him. In 1881 him and Emma were no longer together. Emma didn't legally remarry until 1894....so not sure if William died????

this is on freebdm keynsham covers the saltford area

Marriages Mar 1872 (>99%)
LUCAS Emma Keynsham 5c 1065
POWELL William Keynsham 5c 1065

this is on familysearch

William Powell

England and Wales Census, 1871
Name: William Powell
Event Type: Census
Event Date: 1871
Gender: Male
Age: 29
Birthplace: Bristol
Schedule Type: Vessel
Parish: Vessel
County: Gloucestershire

this found on family search

William Powell
England and Wales Marriage Registration Index
Name: William Powell
Event Type: Marriage
Registration Quarter: Jan-Feb-Mar
Registration Year: 1872
Registration District: Keynsham
County: Somerset
Event Place: Keynsham, Somerset, England
Volume: 5C
Page: 1065
Line Number: 73

William Powell probably married one of the following people
Name: Emma Lucas

I am still working on this mystery......trying to figure out why the only place I can find a record of the marriage between William and Emma is on free reg.....nothing on free bmd or anywhere else....

(lol, no worries Gins, didn't know if it would lead anywhere!)

Burial
County Somerset
Place Saltford
Church St Mary
RegisterNumber 777
BurialDate 31 Dec 1908
Forename Anne
Relationship
Rel1MaleForename
Rel1FemaleForename
Rel1Surname
Surname VERRIER
Age 82

Baptism
County Somerset
Place Saltford
Church St Mary
RegisterNumber 549
DateOfBirth
BaptismDate 22 Mar 1857
Forename George
Sex M
FatherForename George
MotherForename Anna
FatherSurname WATTS
MotherSurname
Abode Keynsham
FatherOccupation Labourer


(can see above, FreeReg)

Chris :)

Sorry Chris, I didnt see your earlier post this morning, re Anna (Hannah)

Karen, looks like Anna' (Hannah' husband)



1911 England Census

Name:Eli Venni

Age in 1911:68

Estimated Birth Year:abt 1843

Relation to Head:Lodger

Gender:Male

Birth Place:Ling, Somerset

Civil Parish:Saltford

County/Island:Somerset
Country:England

Street Address:3 Maud Buildings, Saltford, Nr.Bristol

Marital Status:Widowed

Occupation:Lock Keeper

Registration District:Keynsham

Registration District Number:317
Sub-registration District:Keynsham
ED, institution, or vessel:13
Household Schedule Number:48
Piece:14785

Household Members:

Arthur Densby 33
Alice Densby 33
Jeffrey Horbor 8
Eli Venni 68

I will definitely look into her...I did give it a quick try but came up blank on the name...will see if she leads me anywhere...Thanks!

Hi Karen

I was wondering if this lady might be worth chasing? Looks she could be a match for the witness on William & Emma's marriage?


England & Wales, FreeBMD Death Index, 1837-1915

Name:Anna Verrier

Estimated Birth Year:abt 1826

Date of Registration:Oct-Nov-Dec 1908

Age at Death:82

Registration District:Keynsham

Inferred County:Somerset
Volume:5c
Page:358

Chris.. The above post is what set me looking for William Powell... It would seem my Great grandmother was an interesting lady! Reggie my grandfather was James Davies -Powell...I do have his birth cert. which is in the name of James Davies....after Thomas Davies died and my grandfather joined the reg. army he enlisted as James Powell and my grandparents marriage cert says James Davies Powell.....so far the only thing I have to go on to find Willaim Powell is this marriage record and based on it a birth date circa 1843....I do know that based on family photos of James and Bertha, they more than likely had the same father.....I can't find a single photo of Emma or any of the men she was with! We do know she married William but where he came from or went to is what I'm trying to find...Reggie you do have the correct Emma Lucas from the census I am still in the process of researching Emma's brother's and sister to see if any descendants can help me....

Emma Lucas married William Powell, a labourer aged 30, from Saltford Somerset, on 07/01/1872 at Saltford Parish Church, giving her age as 19, rather than her real age of 17, but her father is faithfully recorded as James Lucas, labourer. This economical use of the truth appears to be Emma's hallmark, and Saltford is only forty miles from Donhead, a far smaller distance than her subsequent travels to South Wales and Yorkshire. Although William Powell's father is recorded as William Powell, labourer, on the marriage certificate, I have had not been able to positively identify him in any census as the name is very common.

Emma was living with Thomas Davies in Glamorgan in 1881, falsely claiming to be married to him.
Emma was living with George Lilliman in Monk Bretton, Yorkshire 1891, falsely claiming to be married to him.
George Lilliman died in Monk Bretton in 1893, Emma falsely claimed to be his widow.
Emma married Thomas Davies in Wakefield in 1894, falsely claiming to be Emma Lilliman, a widow, Thomas' fate is unknown.
Emma married Edward Allen in Wakefield in 1904, falsely claiming to be Emma Lilliman, a widow. Thomas Davies may still be alive at this time, as indeed could William Powell.


http://www.ancestryaid.co.uk/boards/topic/23536-james-davies-powell/page-2

(not sure if your query on above, seems a problem!)

Chris :)

Marriage (reference)
County Somerset
Place Saltford
Church St Mary
RegisterNumber 60
MarriageDate 07 Jan 1872
GroomForename William
GroomSurname POWELL
GroomAge 30
GroomOccupation Labourer
BrideForename Emma
BrideSurname LUCAS
BrideAge 19
BrideAbode Newton St Loe
GroomFatherForename William
GroomFatherSurname POWELL
GroomFatherOccupation Labourer
BrideFatherForename James
BrideFatherSurname LUCAS
BrideFatherOccupation Labourer
WitnessOneForename Richard
WitnessOneSurname LUCIS
WitnessTwoForename Anna
WitnessTwoSurname VERNIER (perhaps Verrier?)

Chris :)

http://www.freereg.org.uk/cgi/Search.pl


Baptism
County Somerset
Place Saltford
Church St Mary
RegisterNumber 690
DateOfBirth
BaptismDate 10 Apr 1870
Forename Francis
Sex M
FatherForename Eli
MotherForename Anna
FatherSurname VERRIER
MotherSurname
Abode
FatherOccupation Labourer

(above, Saltford 1870, if relating!)

1871
VERRIER, Ely Head M 29 1842 Somerset
VERRIER, Hannah Wife F 39 1832 Dorset
WATTS, George Son M 15 1856 Somerset
WATTS, Henryetta Daughter F 13 1858 Somerset
WATTS, Elizabeth Daughter F 11 1860 Somerset
WATTS, Ellen Daughter F 9 1862 Somerset
WATTS, Charles Son M 7 1864 Somerset
WATTS, Albert Son M 5 1866 Somerset
VARRIER, Francis M 1 1870 Somerset
Piece: 2502
Folio: 21
Page: 10
Registration District: Keynsham
Civil Parish: Saltford
Municipal Borough:
Address: Street, Saltford
County: Somersetshire

Marriages Dec 1869 (>99%)
--------------------------------------
VERIER Eli Bristol 6a 66
Watts Anna Bristol 6a 66

Is this EMMA?

1861 census


Person: LUCAS, Emma Address: 4, Trim Bridge, St Michael, Bath

LUCAS, James Head Married M 45 1816 French Polisher
Road, Somerset VIEW
LUCAS, Jane Wife Married F 40 1821
Taunton, Somerset VIEW
LUCAS, Thomas Son Unmarried M 19 1842 Porter
Bath, Somerset VIEW
LUCAS, Emma Daughter F 10 1851 Scholar
Bath, Somerset

Was William not your great grandfather?

Which child of Emma's was your grandparent?

When and where was he/she born?

Where was EMMA born?

Have you found him in 1881 ?

I have a January 7th, 1872 parish marriage record for a William Powell age 30, labourer son of William Powell labourer to Emma Lucas (my great grandmother) aged 19, no occupation father James Lucas bride abode Newton St. Loe, witnesses were Richard Lucas and Anna Vernier. This marriage is listed at St. Mary Saltford Somerset. Anyone have any ideas on how to get more info on William Powell? I tried the census for the area in 1871 but no luck......