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Victoria
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25 Jul 2013 15:47 |
Hello,
I'm looking for information on the parents and childhood of John William Deuce, b c1839 (1891 Census has it as 1832) in the Hunslet area of Leeds.
His marriage certificate has no father's details.
I cannot find him on the 1851 census, but I have a possible match on the 1841 census:
William Duce 20 Sarah Ann Duce 20 John William Duce 1, Living Moor side Forster Buildings, Leeds.
I found a possible match for his parents on the 1851 census, but John Wm doesn't appear.
Can anyone shed any light on this?
Many thanks,
Victoria
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KathleenBell
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25 Jul 2013 15:54 |
Could this be him in the 1861 census as a servant:-
1861 census transcription details for: Golden Lion Hotel, Briggate, Leeds
National Archive Reference: RG number: RG09 Piece: 3396 Folio: 78 Page: 14 Reg. District: Leeds Sub District: 3 West Leeds Parish: Leeds Enum. District: 64 Ecclesiastical District: City/Municipal Borough: Leeds
Address: Golden Lion Hotel, Briggate, Leeds County: Yorkshire (West riding)
Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth Year Occupation , Disability Where Born
CLARK, John Head Married M 49 1812 Hotel Proprietor Nottingham Ratford CLARK, Ellen Wife Married F 41 1820 Nottingham Ratford CLARK, Jane Daughter Unmarried F 21 1840 Nottingham Ratford CLARK, John Henry Son M 7 1854 Nottingham Ratford HAYNES, William Henry Lodger Married M 50 1811 Merchant London, Middlesex THOMPSON, Joseph Lodger Married M 45 1816 Merchant Belfast, Ireland MURRAY, John Lodger Married M 64 1797 Traveller... London, Middlesex MUNKERBECK, John B Lodger Married M 51 1810 Traveller Clothing London, Middlesex GARRAD, William Lodger Unmarried M 35 1826 Traveller Hardware Nottingham Cosington RODMAN, John Hughes Lodger Unmarried M 39 1822 Traveller Hardware Wingfield, Wiltshire ROBINS, George Anbrille Lodger Married M 36 1825 Drainatic Artist Southwaite, Surrey POOLE, Charles Lodger Married M 45 1816 Drainatic Artist Islington, Middlesex POOLE, Amelia Elizabeth Lodger Married F 31 1830 Drainatic Artist Islington, Middlesex LOUNDY, John Lodger Married M 51 1810 Traveller Stationary ..., Gloucestershire GREEN, Thomas Lodger Unmarried M 37 1824 Agent Egglestone, Yorkshire MASON, Thomas Servant Unmarried M 27 1834 Ostler ...Burne, Yorkshire DUCE, John Servant Unmarried M 21 1840 Boots New Wortley, Yorkshire<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< HILL, James Servant Unmarried M 19 1842 Waiter Leeds, Yorkshire HUDSON, Ellen Servant Unmarried F 27 1834 Chamber Maid ..., Yorkshire HUDSON, Margaret Servant Unmarried F 17 1844 Chamber Maid ..., Yorkshire MCNITT, Harriet Servant Unmarried F 19 1842 Kitchen Maid Barwick, Yorkshire RILEY, Hannah Servant Unmarried F 19 1842 House Maid Churwell, Yorkshire SWALLOW, George ... Servant Unmarried M 22 1839 ... Maker Bramham, Yorkshire
EDIT - think this one is wrong as I think his parents are James and Grace in the 1851 census
Kath. x
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Victoria
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25 Jul 2013 16:00 |
Sorry, on the 1861 census he is living with his in laws:
John Oxley 61 Mary 58 Frederick 23 Eliza Jane 16 Issac Riley 35 John w Dewce 22 Sarah 21
They live on Jack Lane, Hunslet. The surname is entered incorrectly, so I struggled to find this, hence I need help.
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ErikaH
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25 Jul 2013 16:41 |
No father's name on marriage cert means illegitimate
Who witnessed his marriage? How old was he on the day?
Have you looked for a baptism for him?
1841 census did not record relationships.................you have no way of knowing how the adults were related to the child, or what their connection was to each other
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ErikaH
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25 Jul 2013 16:47 |
This would appear to confirm the family connections in 1841
Name: John William Duce Gender: Male Christening Date: 13 Oct 1839 Christening Place: SAINT MARK OR SAINT MARK WOODHOUSE,LEEDS,YORK,ENGLAND Birth Date: Birthplace: Death Date: Name Note: Race: Father's Name: William Duce Father's Birthplace: Father's Age: Mother's Name: Sarah Ann Mother's Birthplace: Mother's Age: Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C07194-1 System Origin: England-ODM GS Film number: 918399
But it doesn't prove that he is the one you are researching, as one would have expected this one to know his father's details
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MarieCeleste
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25 Jul 2013 19:23 |
Just posting the marriage record for our reference:
West Yorkshire, England, Marriages and Banns, 1813-1935
Name: John William Deuce - Sawyer, of Steander?? Yard Birth Year: abt 1838 Age: 22 Marriage or Bann Date: 31 Dec 1860 Parish: Leeds, St Peter Spouse's Name: Sarah Oxley (21) of Jack Lane Spouse's Father's Name: John Oxley - Fruiterer Call Number: P 68/5/61
Neither previously married.
Witnesses: Jabez Pickersgill and Betsy Scott.
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alviegal
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25 Jul 2013 22:10 |
Just putting the full 1861.
1861 census transcription details for: 25, Jack Lane, Hunslet, Leeds Print Close
National Archive Reference: RG number: RG09 Piece: 3366 Folio: 66 Page: 4 Reg. District: Hunslet Sub District: 7 Hunslet Parish: Hunslet Enum. District: 9 Ecclesiastical District: St Barnabas City/Municipal Borough: Leeds Address: 25, Jack Lane, Hunslet, Leeds County: Yorkshire (West riding) Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth Year Occupation , Disability Where Born OXLEY, John Head Married M 61 1800 Greengrocer Mirfield, Yorkshire OXLEY, Mary Wife Married F 58 1803 Tadcaster, Yorkshire OXLEY, Frederick Son Unmarried M 23 1838 Machine Maker Leeds, Yorkshire OXLEY, Eliza Jane Daughter Unmarried F 16 1845 Cap Maker Leeds, Yorkshire RILEY, Isaac Son Married M 35 1826 Timber Sawyer Sowerby, Yorkshire >>DEWCE, John W Son In Law Married M 22 1839 Timber Sawyer Leeds, Yorkshire DEWCE, Sarah Daughter Married F 21 1840 Cap Maker Whiston, Lancashire TAYLOR, Nehemiah Lodger Unmarried M 20 1841 Labourer In Tool Foundry Rothwell, Yorkshire
1881 census transcription details for: 2, Ashbey St, Hunslet Print Close
National Archive Reference: RG number: RG11 Piece: 4486 Folio: 70 Page: 18 Reg. District: Hunslet Sub District: Hunslet Parish: Hunslet Enum. District: Ecclesiastical District: City/Municipal Borough: Address: 2, Ashbey St, Hunslet County: Yorkshire (West riding) Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth Year Occupation , Disability Where Born DEUCE, John W Head Married M 42 1839 Wood Sawyer Leeds, Yorkshire DEUCE, Sarah Wife Married F 42 1839 Leeds, Yorkshire DEUCE, Isaac Son Single M 18 1863 Ginger Beer Maker Leeds, Yorkshire DEUCE, Henry Son Single M 13 1868 Scholar Leeds, Yorkshire DEUCE, Alfred Son Single M 5 1876 Scholar Leeds, Yorkshire DEUCE, Isaac T Son Single M 1 1880 Leeds, Yorkshire
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alviegal
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25 Jul 2013 22:15 |
Parish Records Collection 1538-2005 - Burial Print Close First name(s): John William Last name DEUCE Date of burial: 8 Apr 1896 Age at death: 56 Calculated year of birth: 1840 Place of burial: Leeds Dedication: Hunslet Cemetery County: Yorkshire (West Riding)
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Victoria
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26 Jul 2013 15:37 |
On the 1871 Census, it gives his place of birth as Woodhouse. So I suspect that William and Sarah Ann are his parents, I thought that William's details may not be on the marriage certificate because he might have died.
There is a Sarah Ann Deuce who died 1849, Hunslet/Holbeck. There are also William Duce's who died in 1846 and in the 1850s.
However I still cannot find evidence of a marriage between Wm Deuce and Sarah Ann. Or where John Wm is on the 1851 census.
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Mary
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26 Jul 2013 17:48 |
William Duce a mechanic age above 21 married at Woodhouse St Peter on 7/5/1842 to Sarah Frank age above 21,daughter of John Frank a tailor. Father of William was James Duce,witnessed by Abraham Shaw and Ann Lawson
Maryb
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alviegal
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26 Jul 2013 20:47 |
Adding 1851
1851 census transcription details for: 8, Moore Street, Holbeck, Leeds Print Close
National Archive Reference: RG number: HO107 Piece: 2317 Folio: 247 Page: 7 Reg. District: Hunslet Sub District: Holbeck Parish: Holbeck Enum. District: 3H Ecclesiastical District: Brewery Field City/Municipal Borough: Leeds Address: 8, Moore Street, Holbeck, Leeds County: Yorkshire (West riding) Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth Year Occupation , Disability Where Born DEUCE, William Head Married M 33 1818 Mechanic Holbeck, Yorkshire DEUCE, Sarah Wife Married F 31 1820 Holbeck, Yorkshire DEUCE, Celena Daughter F 6 1845 Holbeck, Yorkshire DEUCE, Sophia Daughter F 5 1846 Holbeck, Yorkshire DEUCE, Emily Daughter F 0 (6 MOS) 1851 Holbeck, Yorkshire
and possible Sarah in 1841 before marriage. So she can't be the same Sarah Ann in the 1841, Leeds census in the first posting.
1841 census transcription details for: Mulbury Street, Leeds, Hunslet Print Close
National Archive Reference: RG number: HO107 Piece: 1345 Book/Folio: 4/46 Page: 18 Reg. District: Leeds Sub District: Hunslet Parish: Leeds Enum. District: Ecclesiastical District: City/Municipal Borough: Leeds Address: Mulbury Street, Leeds, Hunslet County: Yorkshire Name Relation Sex Age Birth Year Occupation Where Born GRAYSON, Hannah F 60 1781 Yorkshire FRANK, Sarah F 20 1821 Yorkshire
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Mary
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26 Jul 2013 21:40 |
?? Married in kirkstall Leeds William Deuce full age could be warehouseman married 25/9/1838 father Joseph Thackrey a clothier to Sarah Ann Hardcastle full age father John Hardcastle.
Maryb.
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