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Just to help me get my head into this part of the family ....................


1841 Census

Name: Henry Bartlet
Age: 70
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1771
Gender: Male
Where born: Sussex, England

Civil parish: Brighthelmstone
Hundred: Brighthelmstone
County/Island: Sussex
Country: England

Registration district: Brighton
Sub-registration district: St Peter

Henry Bartlet 70 Tailor
Mary Wood 37 b.ca 1804, Sussex
Elenor Wood 15 b.ca 1826, Sussex
Sarah Wood 12 b.ca 1829, Sussex
Alfred Wood 10 b.ca 1831, Sussex

Address:- Richmond Square



sylvia

Ozi

it all just fell into place when Astra spotted Ellenor Blunden :-D :-D



Linda ................

I'm fine with you writing it up for the History Group magazine.


I'll have a beaver round and see whether I can find anything about the Woods, Bartletts, etc.




sylvia

I'm assuming btw that Henry Bartlet, 70, in 1841 is probably Mary Wood's father. Can't find him in 1851 so I assume he died, which is a shame as I wanted to find his birthplace! FreeBMD gives a death of Henry Bartlett in Brighton in the March quarter 1851 so that's probably him. It also has death of an Ann Catherine Bartlett in Brighton in Sept quarter 1838 - wonder if she could be his wife?

Sylvia, thanks for that extra information - I didn't know that about presumed fathers. I'll see what certificates I can order. Once I've got them
I think I'll write this all up for the Sussex Family History Group magazine, as long as you're all happy for me to do this. I will of course acknowledge all you wonderful people who beaver away solving puzzles! :-)

Wow, you have been working hard while I've been asleep.

Well done to you all.

Ozi

Linda


so pleased that we managed to crack the mystery!!

Certificates are going to be essential to confirming what we have found .... as many as you can afford!


Just one thing ..... if a married woman has a baby after the death of her husband, it is assumed that the dead man was the father of her baby ............. even if it happens 10 years after his death.

Unless, of course, the birth father does acknowledge the child and agree to have his name on the certificate, or she is in a common-law relationship in which she uses the name of her partner.


This is all to say that a man who died in 1847 could be shown on the birth certificate of a child born to his wife 2 years later. Thus a birth certificate is no proof that a man was alive, at least until 9 months before the birth.

....... although, of course, he could not have married her one year after his death :-)


If no-one else does it, I will have a look later to see if we can connect the Mary Wood and her children connect up with John



sylvia

And the 1850 death has to be the right James Blunden - he can't have got married in 1848 if he died in 1847! So James junior is his son, not John Penfold's. It's all falling into place! :-)

Forgot to say that of course this fits in with the Steyning marriage of James Blunden and Eleanor Wood. Wonder why they got married in Steyning?

Did you notice that on the 1851 census Ellenor Blunden and her children are sharing the house with Mary Wood, widow, 47, shoe binding, born Lewes, and her son Alfred 20, shoemaker journeyman, born Brighton? I wonder if this is the connection with John Penfold same trade. In 1841 at Richmond Square, Brighton are Henry Bartlet 70, tailor, Mary Wood 37, Elenor 15, Sarah 12 and Alfred 10. So Ellener and her mother were both widowed very young.

Now to find out which death was the right James Blunden - crucial for deciding who the father of young James was! I think I need to get some certificates! Also Sarah Ann Penfold Blunden's birth certificate - I wondered why I couldn't find her birth (although confusingly there is a Sarah Ann Penfold born in Eastbourne in 1857, the same year.)

I now have the full names of all 16 of my great great grandparents - thanks so much for finding Eleanor! :-)

Wow - fantastic work everyone! I need to print this off and read it all carefully. Thank you soo much.

Sarah Ann Penfold born 1857 is my great grandmother. I have her in 1891 with her husband Samuel Parks and children Alice (my grandmother) and Thomas sharing a house in Brighton with John and Jane Penfold, and in 1901 John Penfold, widowed, is living with Samuel and Sarah and the 2 children in Seaside, Eastbourne - which is where the family were living when my Dad and his sister were born. And John Penfold is described as bootmaker, born Patcham.

I was definitely coming to the conclusion that John and Eleanor weren't married. If James was her son from a previous marriage, he must have taken John's surname as in 1861 he's down as James Penfold. Or maybe the enumerator didn't ask too many questions but just put "ditto" under surname. Anyway, Ill now go away and read it all VERY carefully!

THANK YOU!!! :-)

Thanks Reggie.

Just still not sure about the Jane Elliott marriage in 1866. Not convinced it is the correct one.

Cracking detective work, ladies!

A perfect example of the folly of jumping to conclusions - in this case, who married whom.

:-D :-D :-D :-D

Think we may be there.

Have we cracked it?????


John Penfold did not marry Eleanor Priaulx, she married George Bedford.


John Penfold lived common-law with Eleanor Blunden, a widow with 2 children.


Did she die in 1862, or did the arrangement break up.

Is the death in 1868 her???



He married Jane Elliott in

Marriages Sep 1866 (>99%)

BETTS Alfred Cuckfield 2b 238
>>>>>Elliott Jane Cuckfield 2b 238
>>>>>PENFOLD John Cuckfield 2b 238
ROBINSON Elizabeth Cuckfield 2b 238





and now I must go to bed!! Our clocks go forward tonight ............ so it is either 12:30 am or 1:30 am now!!



sylvia

???????? James Blunden and Eleanor's marriage??


Marriages Mar 1848 (>99%)

>>>>>>>>>Blunden James Steyning 7 591
Eggleton Ruth Mary Steyning 7 591
ELDRIDGE Charles Steyning 7 591
Jepson Samuel Steyning 7 591
SANDERSON Joseph Steyning 7 591
Sharp Sarah Brighton 7 591
Smith Sarah Jane Steyning 7 591
TEELING Caroline Elizabeth Steyning 7 591
>>>>>>>>>>WOOD Eleanor Steyning 7 591



??? James' death

Deaths Jun 1847 (>99%)

Blunden James Brighton 7 223

OR

Deaths Dec 1850 (>99%)

BLUNDEN James Brighton 7 224




?????????????????????????

can't see the death of an Eleanor Penfold BUT ......................

Deaths Mar 1868 (>99%)

Blunden Eleanor 44 Brighton 2b 148





sylvia

I wonder



The births of the two girls seem to match up with the oens on the 1861 Census for John Penfold, and Eleanor.


I've looked, and I cannot see a marriage for John and Eleanor Blunden.


I wonder if they didn't bother marrying?????




sylvia

If this is John in 1871 now married to Jane and a Beermaker there is a daughter Alice born 1862/3

EDIT: Misread his occupation completely. It is Boot maker!


PENFOLD, John Head M 47 1824 Sussex VIEW
PENFOLD, Jane Wife F 41 1830 Sussex VIEW
PENFOLD, Sarah A Daughter F 14 1857 Sussex VIEW
PENFOLD, Alice Daughter F 8 1863 Sussex VIEW
PENFOLD, Annie Q Daughter F 3 1868 Sussex VIEW
PENFOLD, Frederick Son M 1 1870 Sussex VIEW

Civil Parish:
Brighton Municipal Borough:
Brighton Address:
Surrey Street, Brighton County:
Sussex


and the birth registration

Births Dec 1862 (>99%)
BLUNDEN Alice Penfold Brighton 2b 181

YES!!


a possibilty ..........................

I noticed one of the trees on ancestry had

James Peter Penfold:- Blunden


but I couldn't find anything.


and James Blunden's birth ????


Births Mar 1849 (>99%)

BLUNDEN James Henry Brighton 7 349



ah no ......................


England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975 for James Henry Blunden

Name: James Henry Blunden
Gender: Male
Baptism/Christening Date: 20 May 1849
Baptism/Christening Place: St. Nicholas', Brighthelmston, Sussex, England
Birth Date:
Birthplace:
Death Date:
Name Note:
Race:
Father's Name: James Blunden
Father's Birthplace:
Father's Age:
Mother's Name: Eleanor Blunden
Mother's Birthplace:
Mother's Age:
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: I04679-1
System Origin: England-EASy
Source Film Number: 1468824
Reference Number: item 1 p 252



sylvia

I'm wondering about this lady. Maybe way off track but..........

BLUNDEN, Ellener Head Widow F 25 1826 Good Intent (Beer Shop)
Brighton
Sussex VIEW
BLUNDEN, Ellener Daughter F 4 1847
Brighton
Sussex VIEW
BLUNDEN, James Son M 2 1849
Brighton
Sussex VIEW

Brighton Address:
1& 2, Richmond Square, Brighton County:
Sussex


Matching her with this birth for Eliza

Births Sep 1854 (>99%)
Blunden Eliza Penfold Brighton 2b 167

and Sarah Ann in 1857

Births Mar 1857 (>99%)

Blunden Sarah Ann Penfold Brighton 2b 220