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I have tracked him through the Birmingham Electoral rolls, even after he leaves Camden Street. My main objective is to find the marriage if there is one between the two, it doesn't help that it seems he keeps changing the names he goes by. Once the marriage is obtained we can hopefully try and go back in time to descendants but this is proving very difficult nut to crack.

As for the 'Jordan' link, I don't think that's correct because the only electoral rolls where he is living with Edith I believe are in 1934 & 1939, she is not there before that and disappears after that.

1920 He's listed at 2 court 6 Great Francis Street

1922
2 court 6 Great Francis Street

Alfred Elijah Leonard Hill
Maria Harker
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By 1925 he's moved and Maria is at the same address with William Harvey (and also 1927). From 1930 a George William & Violet Florence Gill are living at the address.
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1930

223 Camden Street
Alfred Elijah Leonard Hill
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1960

223 Camden Street
Leonard A E Hill
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He does not appear at 223 Camden Street after 1960.

I know this is only a remote possibility

Marriages Dec 1915 (>99%)
Jordan Benjamin J Smith Wolverhampton 6b 1293
Smith Edith A Jordan Wolverhampton 6b 1293

Marriages Dec 1924 (>99%)
Hill Alfred J P Jordan Wolverhampton 6b 1263
Jordan Edith Hill Wolverhampton 6b 1263

I know I'm draggin this back up but I have now got more information from the 1939 Register. On this Leonard and Edith Hill (maiden name Smith going by their daughters birth certificate) are living together at the forementioned 223 Camden Street Birmingham.
On this it gives their births as Leonard - 19th Feb 1889 and Edith - 26th Feb 1899. So when you look for births there doesn't seem to be anything that matches.
I have no marriage record that I can see or no birth records that are obvious. It seems to be one brick wall after another on this one.

I'm doing this for a friend of mine and the marriage I'm looking for is the marriage of her grandparents, and its not like we can ask anyone, as Sylvia (my friends mother) we think was their only child and she died when my friend was only 4 and there really isn't anyone out there to ask.
There is talk of a gypsy background but again I have no idea if this is even traceable or not if true.

Rhys

Problem is, he could have used any first names he felt like, so it's impossible to say what his birth names were, or in what order. I did a random search for an Alfred L E Hill (anything, anywherre!)and found this, but no idea at all if it relates to him obviously:

Marriages Sep 1959
BEECHAM Ellen HILL Birmingham 9c 1196 9c 1196
HILL Alfred L E BEECHAM Birmingham 9c 1196

If it was by any remote chance the same man it goes without saying it was a late marriage! Must say I am pretty stumped by this one.

Jan

Well on the daughters birth certificate in 1934 the mothers name is listed as Edith Smith, and on the few electoral rolls I have there is an Edith Hill living with Alfred Elijah Leonard Hill. I have however just assumed they were married.
Is there a significance to the possible name change from Alfred Elijah Leonard Hill to just Leonard Hill over the period of World War 2?

He is a gas worker in 1934 on the birth certificate, whilst on on his daughters marriage certificate, he is retired.
As for other later electoral rolls, I have a Leonard Hill at the same address until 1955 but no wife Edith, she seems to disappear between 1939 and 1945, that is if this Leonard Hill is the same as Alfred Elijah Leonard.

Are you absolutely certain that they did marry? Between the first and second world wars a lot of marriages broke up and because divorce was so expensive and therefore out of the reach of ordinary working class people a lot just separated and then went on to live with other partners as man and wife even though they never actually married. This happened with my husband's parents.

Kath. x

Have you been able to look at the address on later electoral registers? Also, does occupation match on both certs?
Jan

You may notice I refer to him as Leonard as well as Alfred Leonard Elijah, well he is listed as Leonard Hill on his daughters marriage certificate, but on the probable birth certificate it is Alfred Leonard. The Elijah only seems to appear on electoral rolls apart from that possible birth suggested by Brummie Jan (thanks!). I guess I'm just after some concrete evidence to prove whether these are one and the same person.

I have since found Alfred/Leonard with Edith in 1931, so the marriage must be before then.

Rhys

Possible death? :-

Name: HILL, Alfred L
Registration District: Birmingham
County: Warwickshire
Year of Registration: 1962
Quarter of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar
Age at death: 68
Volume No: 9C
Page No: 486

Kath. x

?

Births Mar 1890 (>99%)
Hill Alfred Leonard E Birmingham 6d 218

Woah! Lets bring this back from the depths

I am still searching for this marriage but I do have them at 223 Camden Street in Birmingham on the 1939 Electoral Rolls where he is down as a Alfred Leonard Elijah Hill living with a Edith Hill who I believe is his wife and a Sylvia Hill who must be some relative and someone who I guess they named their daughter after.

I also know Leonard was alive in 1957 when his daughter got married but the talk is they were estranged. At least if I had a death I could move things back that way with an approx birthdate.

Well I got the Alfred Leonard Hill & Edith Smith from the birth certificate of Sylvia's birth certificate. Alas nothing more than that, though somewhere there could have been a mistake in transcribing.

Is there more likely to be a mistake with FreeBMD or on a birth certificate?

Rhys

Marriages Dec 1932 (>99%)
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Hill Wilfred M Smith Birmingham 6d 348

Births Jun 1934 (>99%)
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Hill Sylvia B Smith Birmingham 6d 244

Guessing on both counts!

Have you looked on the FreeBMD site

Looks like his name is Wilfred

Marriages Dec 1932 (>99%)
Armstrong Annie R Ewers Birmingham 6d 348
Ewers Harold W Armstrong Birmingham 6d 348
Hill Wilfred M Smith Birmingham 6d 348
Smith Edith C Hill Birmingham 6d 348

I am trying to find a record of the marriage of Alfred Hill & Edith Smith. All I know of them is they had a daughter approx 1934 in Birmingham called Sylvia Hill.
I have heard that Alfred, although called named Alfred, was actually known as Leonard, which could well be his middle name.
Anyway any information related to the wedding or whatever would be very much appreciated.

Cheers

Rhys