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Sorry! I'd read what LK copied over:

"My Great Grandfather Ernest Daubeney (b.about 1870) had a brother Robert Tait Daubeney who was in the Northumberland Fusiliers."

assuming it was you who wrote it. So that's one of the ones in the same boat as you, a dangling Daubeney in the tree.

So Robert is your man. Well, we should still see whether anything can be found that might lead to Robert of course.

If Ernest was the milkman he was definitely my ancestor. According to my little sister's grade 10 biology teacher (who had also been mine 14 years earlire), anyway, when she could not complete her BB Bb genetics assignment because there was no way to produce a grid for two parents with light-blue and light-green eyes bringing forth four brown-eyed offspring.

Connect yourself to Ernest the milkman, and we're cousins!

Janey - I'm not 100% that Ernest is an ancestor (no proof that he's Robert's brother) but Robert is definitely my GGrandfather.

I've never found any military record for Ernest, as far as I know he was a milkman (yes, I know - he was probably the inspiration for that song!) and his name on marriage was Ernest Albert. He married Elizabeth Mansfield on 21 Sep 1891 at Forest Gate Parish Church.

Robert was in South Africa from 15 Mar 1901 to 04 Jun 1902

More things to know -- Ernest's full name.

Marriages Sep 1891
Daubeney Ernest Albert W. Ham 4a 56

There's a bride missing. Yours was? Was he in SA in 1901? What place of birth do censuses have for him?

Basically, he's your actual ancestor, so it's his ancestors we're after, so we may as well have all the dirt on him.

Name: Ernest Daubney
Age: 11
Estimated birth year: abt 1870
Relation: Inmate
Where born: Leytonstone, Essex, England

Civil Parish: Leyton Low
Registration district: West Ham
Country: England
Street address: "West Ham Union School"

LK - that's exactly the thing. Although as Jax rightly found he does give Ernest as brother (and it does look like older, but I don't think it's likely) I'm not 100% they were full brothers, may perhaps have been cousins?

I thought it odd that one "brother" would be at what I understand to have been (and still is) a prestigious military musical school while the other was at a workhouse school, but that may be because Ernest was too young to be enroled anywhere like that.

On 1881 there is this

Household DAUBNEY, Ernest 1870 11 M West Ham Essex
Address: West Ham Union School, Low Leyton (Aka Workhouse)

I cant find him on 1871,nor do I see a birth to match.

LK -- on Robert's enrolment papers he names brother Ernest, although the attachment to a particular Ernest might be tenuous?

I assume that we have moved far enough into modern times that the families know each other and that they're related. Possible they weren't actual sibs, or full sibs, maybe ...

I have found messages
from you and another researcher I believe you have had contact with.


I thought this one was interesting

"I read these messages about General Sir H.C.B.Daubeney. I am trying to trace Daubeney's and am having problems. My Great Grandfather Ernest Daubeney (b.about 1870) had a brother Robert Tait Daubeney who was in the Northumberland Fusiliers. The boys both married and their marriage certificates in 1889 and 1891 state that their father was a soldier but deceased. The biggest problem is that Ernest's certificates names the father as James Daubeney and Robert's as Frederick Charles. Any relation? "


So how sure are you they were brothers?

Births Mar 1871
Hill Ernest Clifford Braintree 4a 383

Dang ... I was going to mention that my Ernest Hill born 1851 was in Poplar in 1871 ...

Just my hill fixation. No marriage or death for that one. But he's in 1871 with father Edward and mother Emily and a load of sibs. Oh, and father is Rector of Panfield. Snork. Ignore me.

Yes Fans - well done Chris! My search including variants never brought that one up.

23 in June 1888 -- so could have just turned 23 (born 1865) or be almost 24 (born 1864).

I don't think the other one's a coincidence, I think it's just one of the relatively plentiful Lincolnshire Daub*neys. This one, in fact. Not our one.

Births Sep 1869
DAUBNEY Robert Lincoln 7a 465
Marriages Mar 1892
Daubney Robert Lincoln 7a 726
HARE Elizabeth Matilda Lincoln 7a 726

1901 - He was on active service in South Africa
(Can't find Jane and family on census, but I know they had moved to Shotley Bridge in Northumberland by that time)

Have you noted that Chris Ho :) has found your Jane on 1901 MC?

It also says older brother but the only one that fits for Ernest was born 1871ish cannot see record of birth though only death and marriage

ja...x

Janey, sorry - attending to domestic drama at same time!

When I said the wrong Robert I meant the Robert Eleanor one! And I'm not sure about the groom one, but the name is just too much of a coincidence.

The link you gave from FMP - yes that's him. And Jax is definitely right.

He was 23 when he married, but it's a bad scan of the marriage cert and can't see who witnesses were - need to buy new copy, methinks.

Yup, sounds like a different one. Where is MC??
Daubeney was very much a Lincolnshire name, from browsing GRO births etc.

jax has the right one, surely -- wife Jane, brother Ernest, right area, Essex. Why is MC saying nay?


............. Well, so far, Chris has found the family in 1901! ................

Before he married Jane his next of kin was a brother called Ernest who live in Forest Gate if you dont know the area its near West Ham or Stratford

ja...x

This is very difficult to read but his father is David and he is married to Elizabeth Mathilda Hare in a register office in Lincoln.? Maybe there are 2 of them? He was in South Africa 1899

Okay, I'm confused. Jax gave us (minus the bumphy spacing)

First name(s): Robert
Last name: DAUBNEY
Calculated year of birth: 1865
Parish of birth: West Ham
Town of birth: West Ham
County of birth: Essex
Age at attestation: 14 years 4 months
Attestation date: 14 August 1879
Attestation corps: 1ST BRIGADE
Attestation soldier number: 2465

I don't think that in that era anyone enrolled at that age unless they were a musician. That is the story on my paternal grandfather -- drummer boy in Egypt at the age of 13 or some such.


LK gives us

He was 18 years and 9 months at time of enlistment at Woolwich
Fine, as long as we're editing ;) -- 22 may 1888 -- making him born 1869. That's rather different from other records.
And editing some more -- a groom in 1888 -- but our guy seems to have been musical?


MC -- what was his age when he married 19 June 1889 again?

He was 18 years and 9 months at time of enlistment at Woolwich, 22 may 1888
looks like borogh of New? so probably north Woolwich. Easy to get to though as foot tunnel and ferry over Thames.
He was a groom.

I'll put my high-falutin Moncks up against your high-falutin Daubeneys. ;)

What's all this? -- "Janey - that's a different Robert on FMP."

jax checked the record and I assume it said wife Jane or something.

And West Ham certainly seems to be our stomping grounds, viz the record for brother Ernest you posted.


Now speaking of Ernests ... Ernest HILLs to be specific ... we have this stray fellow in 1871 ...

Name: Robert T Hill
Age: 7
Estimated birth year: abt 1864
Relation: Boarder
Where born: London, England

Civil Parish: Kensington
County/Island: London
Registration district: Kensington

Grace T Treger 58 - principal of boarding school
Cecelia Treger 26
Mary Treger 23
Thomas Treger 22
James Tregear 18
Catharine M Downs 55
[excising several unrelated pupils]
Robert T Hill 7
Victoria J Hill 9
Janey Hill 3

Look! Janey Hill!

Births Sep 1861
HILL Victoria Jane Hackney 1b 343

> No birth of a Robert T Hill anytime around then. Could that surname be an error?

Looking at the staff and the staff in surrounding and what seem to be related households of pupils and staff, there are a lot of music teachers.

How do you like this guy??

Births Dec 1865
De Labert-Auche Robert Thomas W. Ham 4a 49

;)

just making my mark for later


sylvia