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?I wonder if this might have any connection to a change of name?


England & Wales, Criminal Registers, 1791-1892 about John Betteridge
Name: John Betteridge
Date of Trial: 3 Jan 1882
Trial Year: 1882
Location of Trial: Derbyshire, England
Sentence: Imprisonment
Crime: See Image
Date of Execution or Release: See Image

Larceny (simple) before convicted of felony.

Imprisonment 1 year and hard labor.


Of course, it may not be the same person?

Dea x

Oopps - I see we have 2 threads on the go! - You really must stick to just one on the same people please.

Dea x

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/ancestors/thread/1338301

nudged for Jim Soton

No Angela I don't as yet but I have just done a sweep of Sheepshed in 1881 and THERE IS another George Kirk - an unmarried guy of 22 actually born in Sheepshed !! Not that this proves anything, but if they lived in adjoining streets or something, that could perhaps account for the enumerator getting a bit mixed up.

Margaret

It's just strange that John & George are

1) roughly the same age

2) born in the same place

3) have the same occupation.

Do you have the birth certs of any of the children?

Angela

Sorry Christina I obviously misunderstood. I, like you, have checked through the 1871 census and I cannot find a George Kirk born Measham either. What puzzles me is the choice of name - George Kirk is nothing like John Bettridge !! My only other thought that it is a mistake in transcription or the enumerator put in George Kirk by mistake !! or John Bettridge was up to mischief. I'm going to have a quick look and see if there was in fact a George Kirk living in the village of Sheepshed in 1881 - just out of curiosity. Thank you very much for trying to help.

No. What I meant was - have you found him on the 1881 census? He's on all the others, so he must be around for the 1881 census. But he isn't! Therefore, he must be George Kirk. I've looked through all the other censuses, but there's no George Kirk from Measham on any of them, except the 1881. Therefore, I think John Betteridge is going under the name of George Kirk on the 1881 census.

Hi Christina - I have John Bettridge on 1871, 1861 and 1851 census returns, so he didn't in fact change his name. Thank you for the suggestion.

Have you ever found John Betteridge on the 1881 census? Or a possible George Kirk on any other census? I would say they were one and the same person. Intrigued as to why he would change his name though.

I've got ancestors who changed their surname & also the husband seemed to alternate between John & THomas. He was already married & trying to hide, I believe!

Hi Angela - yes that is indeed the 1873 marriage I found BUT if Jim Soton is correct and the Martha Bettridge is indeed the same person as Martha Kirk, then she was still with first husband in 1873 !! I just can't sort this out.

Margaret

How about this?

Marriages Sep 1873 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Bettridge John Uttoxeter 6b 489
Bottrill Martha Uttoxeter 6b 489
Harmer Saul Uttoxeter 6b 489
SNELL Eliza Harriet Uttoxeter 6b 489
SNELL Eliza Harriett Uttoxeter 6b 489

Is it possible John & George were the same person - & changed their name for some reason?

Posted this about 2.30 this afternoon but no response so am now nudging for the 'night shift'....... thanks

About a month back I put up a thread asking for help locating Martha Bottrill b.1854 on 1871 and 1881 census because I just could not locate her. I had her on 1891 census with husband John Bettridge and children Lilly, William, Arthur, Gertrude, Beatrice, John and Samuel.. I also had a marriage date of 1873.

Jim Soton – that extraordinarily perceptive man – found on the 1881 census the following family living Shepshed: George Kirk 35 b. Measham, Martha 27 b. Walton, Lilly 6 b. Stapnhill, William 4 b. Leicester, Arthur 2 b. Derby. What didn’t strike me at the time was what Jim later pointed out to me when he compared the 1881 and 1891 census returns …. Look at the names – ages, places of birth…..

John Betteridge abt 1848 Marsham 1891 census
George Kirk abt 1846 Measham, 1881 census
both brickmakers
Martha Betteridge abt 1854 Walton, 1891 census
Martha Kirk abt 1854 Walton, 1881 census
Lilly Betteridge abt 1875 Stapenhill, 1891 census
Lilly Kirk abt 1875 Staplehill, 1881 census
William Betteridge abt 1877 Leicester,1891 census
William Kirk abt 1877 Leicester 1881 census
Arthur Betteridge abt 1879 Derby, 1881 census
Arthur Kirk abt 1879 Derby 1891 census

Identical !! Ah! The penny dropped – Martha had been married twice.! Simple, so I thought until I searched for the marriage of George Kirk and Martha Bottrill (also tried alternatives Botterill, Botril, Botrile, Bottrell) but could not find one. The only one I came across where George Kirk married a Martha was Dec 1876 (which would fit in with the first child’s birth) reg’d Ashby de la Zouch but the bride’s name was Martha Nicklin Ordish. Then a second penny dropped when I realised that I had a marriage date of 1873 for Martha and John Bettridge - ?husband No. 2? – so if she married John in 1873 and was still with him in 1891, how the heck could she be with George Kirk in 1881? I am getting deeper and deeper into this maze and just cannot see what is probably staring me in the face. Is there a solution to this, or am I stuck in this maze forever ?